Starship Asterisk*

Hello,

This weekend I ventured out to the tree farm with my family - my wife, baby girl and I, my folks, and my sister and her family - on our annual "Christmas tree hunt." It's something I've been a part of my whole life. I am especially excited this year as it is our daughter's first Christmas tree!

I happen to live in a part of the country where Christmas trees are grown and thus easily accessible. As I understand it, in some places Christmas trees are prohibitively expensive. The members of this board come from a wide range of locations. I am curious about the experiences of others - where they get their trees, what they cost, preferred tree type, alternatives, or if they even bother.

Our tree is a grand fir; it came from a small family-owned U-Cut farm outside rural Oregon City, Oregon and cost 15 dollars (irrespective of height. In fact I had to do some serious trimming this year, our tree "grew" on the way home). For comparison: retail establishments around here usually sell pre-cut trees for 20 to 40 dollars depending on height and species (noble firs always cost more).

Oh, Orca, what fun you are in for!! One year when my son was young, he stood amongst his unwrapped presents and stocking goodies and exclaimed with awe and happiness, "I must be the luckiest boy in the world!!" (I hadn't realized upon marrying his dad that I was marrying into a family that Did.Christmas.Presents.In.A.Big.Way; my family of origin's idea of presents were jars of macadamia nuts or cans of cashews and canned cat food [we all had cats, I hasten to add]. Yes, these items were wrapped; one usually didn't even need to open one's presents to know what they were, as the shape of the package made it clear whether one was getting cashews, macadamia nuts, or the occasional package of pistachios. One year, one family member gave everyone extension cords and flashlights purchased on the way to the family dinner from CVS. Given that he didn't always show up at holiday meals, this counts as a touching memory for me. But I digress.)

Firs are usually a bit more expensive here than pine Christmas trees. Naturally, the kid and I both prefer fir trees. We've had Scotch pines, a white pine one year (which, no matter how much one put on it, never looked decorated, so my inclination is to put only white lights -- lots of them -- on these and nothing else), a Blue Spruce one year (never never never again; looked great, stabbed us well into the new year), Douglas, Fraser (our favorite), Balsam, and most recently, Canaan firs. (Noble firs aren't very common here and we've never had one, though I do like them a lot.) The last couple of trees I've gotten have been organically-grown Canaan firs which are grown in Maryland; the farmer takes orders (I email mine to his wife), cuts trees to fill those orders plus a few more, and people pick up the trees either at his house or at the weekend Farmer's Market in his little city (which abuts DC). I've picked up my trees at his house. He also lets people go to the farm to pick out the tree they want cut if they desire.

Over the years, I've found I react to something on commercially grown trees. I used to fear it was the tree itself and that I'd have to give up having a tree; I tried an organically grown tree a few years ago, found I could breathe through the holidays (O frabjous day!!!), so now buy only organic. I don't know whether it's a pesticide residue or a preservative sprayed on the tree after cutting that I was reacting to, but since finding a solution, don't much care.

My living room has a 9' ceiling, so I have usually gotten trees about 8' tall for that room. One year, we had three trees: a large one in the living room, a smaller one (maybe 6') in the dining room in front of the patio door, and a table-top tree in my son's room. (The first time he had a tree in his room, Santa brought it; all the lights and ornaments -- it didn't take many -- were his as well. Each year, he picks out a new ornament for me to buy him, and I also give him one he doesn't pick out; when he was young, we often made ornaments in lieu of buying them. When he moves into his own home, he will take these with him and, my hope is, carry part of his childhood holidays with him through at least part of his adulthood.)

Not that I have anything to say about this particular (and/or any other) holiday tradition...

No Christmas trees or decorations for me. Used to do it with my mom or dad depending on which parent I was spending Christmas with but now that I'm with Pat his family apparently doesn't see the point of it. Same with a lot of western traditions. Best thing we get is a bit of a feast with some family friends on Thanksgiving but there's only maybe one or two traditional western foods. One of the daughters made her first pumpkin pie this year. The main attraction in this case is char siu rather than turkey or ham. Also, Pat being a doctor and doing a lot of intensive care rotations ends up with us doing holiday roulette. Sometimes he gets the day off, sometimes he doesn't. Such is life.

Last year I bought a scotch pine! This season I brought out the artificial tree! The live trees shed so many needles that it becomes a hassle when it is time to take them down. I still get a live tree occasionally as does bring back a lot of memories. My favorites are the fir trees.

I'm with Troop 199 in Mission, Kansas, and every year we sell Christmas trees. We sell fraser firs, balsam firs, douglas firs, blue spruces, white pines, and scotch pines. These sales provide enough money for camping supplies every month so that we can go on campouts every month. We sell over 1500 trees every year! I got a table top fraser fir on Sunday, and it made a great centerpiece.

Owlice, those blue spruce trees do hurt! One year a scout ran into one and actually needed rubbing alcohol and a couple bandages (probably obvious what happened). Carrying them to be bagged is like torture. It's similar to the scotch pines. Their needles are also pretty prickly.

The Fraser firs are very expensive: a six-seven (6-7) fraser costs more than an 8-9 white pine, and a 10-11 Fraser costs a whopping $185! Fortunately, a balsam fir is similar to a fraser fir and costs way less. They are also very fragrant!

Have any of you gotten a Douglas fir? I'm thinking of getting one but I'm not so sure. They're pretty wide, and I don't think it will fit. I might end up getting a balsam fir instead.

Owlice - this is the first Christmas in a long time I have really looked forward to. Not that I don't normally enjoy it; any reason to get together with family and friends is fine in my book. I just always think of new experiences she'll have. I am told that next year will be really fun; she'll be old enough to tear into presents!

I've never had a pine tree. They are pretty, though I hear they are especially messy (lots of sap). Spruce are beautiful trees but much too pokey. I am not familiar with Fraser, Balsam, or Canaan firs; they must be East Coast varieties. Nobles are pretty (and sought after) but to me they always seem to have gaps that are too large. Grand firs are my favorite; they have really nice color and sheen, the branches are full but not overly crowded, and they release a lot of fragrance.

TNT - Douglas firs are very common in my neck of the woods; they are generally the cheapest type of Christmas tree around here. They do the job well enough; however I find that they tend to be on the bushy side, which makes hanging ornaments difficult.

Orca, the next couple of Christmases might see her opening a present and... going no further, because she'll be playing with whatever she's unwrapped; many small kids I've known want to play rather than unwrap, so don't get your hopes too high for her tearing into presents next year, nor even, perhaps, for the next few! When my son was very young, it took days and days and days for him to open all his Christmas presents. This was rather nice, as in those years, we didn't have just one Christmas morning, but many.

And yes, Fraser, Balsam, and Canaan are eastern trees, with Canaan having the smallest geographic range. They are all splendid Christmas trees.

TNT, I've had Douglas firs several times. I usually have good space for a tree, so their width isn't prohibitive. Blue Spruces do hurt! Never again! And the Scotch pines hurt, too, but they are by far the least expensive trees in this area, so are fairly popular.

We have a few tens of thousands of trees on our ranch- mostly Ponderosa, but quite a bit of Colorado Blue Spruce, as well. One of those becomes our Solstice tree each year (we don't celebrate Christmas). Spruce tend to seed in little clusters, and if they are to grow big, one has to push the others aside. So when I pick our tree, I always cut one from a little grouping, which gives us a tree and makes the remaining stand a bit healthier.

After Solstice, I trim the branches away and let the trunk dry for the following year. It then becomes our Yule log, which we burn on Solstice morning, when we open our gifts.

Your photography technique is very effective for making your dog appear to be floating.

I don't see the dog floating, but the part of the place in the picture, looks rather cozy. I'm not predgidous, i don't celebrate anything. Simpler that way.

Wow, Chris! That's pretty interesting. Our family has a party on Christmas Eve, where our whole family comes over with presents for everyone. Our family celebrates Christmas like any ordinary way - we set up our tree, go to bed, then on Christmas morning open presents. For the rest of the day we drive around, relax, and go to the Church service. After that, at night, we drive again to see all the Christmas lights that everyone strung up.

I'm not familiar with noble firs, canan firs, or grand firs. I guess they're not too common around here. But I think I'm just going to put up our artificial tree this year.

I don't think the dog looks like it's floating, either.

(By the way, I posted this comment right after Beyond, so I don't mean to be insulting -if that's the right word- in any way.)

It's because of the lack of shadow. Makes it look like his rump is floating a few inches higher than his forelimbs and head.

geckzilla wrote:It's because of the lack of shadow. Makes it look like his rump is floating a few inches higher than his forelimbs and head.

Ya know, now that you've said that, i took another look, and it does seem like the dog is lying on a slight slope, from back to front, which makes It's rear end look higher. If It's not just an optical illusion, maybe the dog has a lot of gas it hadn't released before Chris took the picture and It's rear end IS actually off the floor a bit

Beyond wrote:Ya know, now that you've said that, i took another look, and it does seem like the dog is lying on a slight slope, from back to front, which makes It's rear end look higher. If It's not just an optical illusion, maybe the dog has a lot of gas it hadn't released before Chris took the picture and It's rear end IS actually off the floor a bit :?:

I considered that response. Bella was a VERY gassy dog (she died a few months ago). But the particular gas involved is heavier than air, so I don't think floating is possible via that mechanism. Now jet propulsion...

It's amazing sometimes how animals are so much like people. Must be the environment we are all in.
Jet propulsion Doggone .... I never would have thought of that.

This has been a very interesting thread. I haven't participated, because I'm too lazy to have a tree myself (it's too messy, getting it in and getting it out, and then having all those needles lying on the floor seemingly for weeks afterwards, until you get rid of the last ones). But I like seeing other people's handsome trees.

Chris, I'm sorry about the death of your dog. As for her being gassy, I've known a few other big dogs that were gassy as well. It comes with the size, perhaps.

I really like your "Solstice tree". It is my opinion that people who live close enough to the poles to be affected by the winter solstice will mark its passing with some ceremony, and usually they will have a party, too. In other words, I think that the solstice is the primary reason for the holiday, and religious ceremonies will be held at that time of year primarily because it is already a "party day".

The Vikings here in Scandinavia certainly celebrated the solstice before they were Christians, and your English word "yuletide" comes from the old Nordic word "jul", which we still use in Sweden, Denmark and Norway. (We even have the somewhat old-fashioned word "juletid", meaning the time of Christmas - or rather, the time of "jul".) What we celebrate in late December is "jul", not Christ-mas(s), and nothing about our name for the holiday suggests that it has anything to do with Christ. And we still eat the kind of "jul" food that the Vikings would eat when they had a big party. The Vikings would slaughter their fattest pig and eat ham, sausages and all kinds of pork products made of the poor piggie, and our Swedish Christmas food is still predominantly pork.

Ann

TNT wrote:(By the way, I posted this comment right after Beyond, so I don't mean to be insulting -if that's the right word- in any way.)

I cannot distort my thought processes in any way that lets me find anything remotely insulting in your comments about how your family celebrates the winter holiday season.

Ann wrote:I really like your "Solstice tree". It is my opinion that people who live close enough to the poles to be affected by the winter solstice will mark its passing with some ceremony, and usually they will have a party, too. In other words, I think that the solstice is the primary reason for the holiday, and religious ceremonies will be held at that time of year primarily because it is already a "party day".

It is well established that early Christians co-opted existing holidays for their own. As have other religions. It only makes good sense when you are trying to convert a population. I doubt there are older celebrations than those of the solstices and the equinoxes. Certainly, the "Christmas tree" predates Christianity.

Remember the reason for the season... astronomy!

geckzilla wrote:Remember the reason for the season... astronomy! :b:

Winter solstice: the longest night of the year.

bystander wrote:Dec 22, 2010 - What Christmas Is All About

Sol Invictus seems like a nice one to bring back for all the solar astronomers out there <g>.

The observation of the winter solstice could be called one of the earliest forms of astronomy, right?

geckzilla wrote:The observation of the winter solstice could be called one of the earliest forms of astronomy, right?

It's an interesting question to me, since I study archaeoastronomy.

Really, "astronomy" implies a scientific study of the sky, which certainly wasn't present in pretechnological societies. But they did study the sky- for spiritual reasons, and for practical ones. Recognizing the cyclical nature of the year- the seasons, the changing star patterns, the movement of the Moon, the significance of what we now call the solstices and equinoxes... these things must have come very early indeed.

Stonehenge, the earliest solar observatory?











Ann