Comments and questions about the
APOD on the main view screen.
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Ann
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by Ann » Mon Feb 19, 2024 6:05 am
There is a cluster in the very beginning of the video (at 2 seconds). Could this cluster be M11? What do you think?
Ann
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JohnD
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by JohnD » Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:33 am
Some further Qs. In front of the passing view of the sky are random (?) streaks. Are these particles in the Corona, that we see further out but in front of the starry sky beyond? Or are they radiation particles, directly affecting the camera? And why are so many such streaks curved? A charged particle would curve in a strong magnetic field, but is the Sun's field so powerful where Parker is?
John
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Chris Peterson
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by Chris Peterson » Mon Feb 19, 2024 2:25 pm
JohnD wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:33 am
Some further Qs. In front of the passing view of the sky are random (?) streaks. Are these particles in the Corona, that we see further out but in front of the starry sky beyond? Or are they radiation particles, directly affecting the camera? And why are so many such streaks curved? A charged particle would curve in a strong magnetic field, but is the Sun's field so powerful where Parker is?
John
They are certainly high energy particles interacting with the sensor. But we're not seeing the particles directly. Rather, we're seeing electrons they create inside individual pixels as they are moving through the bulk of the sensor material, where they undergo collisions and spawn secondary or tertiary particles and interact with other atoms. Which is presumably why the paths are so complex.
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johnnydeep
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by johnnydeep » Mon Feb 19, 2024 2:28 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 2:25 pm
JohnD wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:33 am
Some further Qs. In front of the passing view of the sky are random (?) streaks. Are these particles in the Corona, that we see further out but in front of the starry sky beyond? Or are they radiation particles, directly affecting the camera? And why are so many such streaks curved? A charged particle would curve in a strong magnetic field, but is the Sun's field so powerful where Parker is?
John
They are certainly high energy particles interacting with the sensor. But we're not seeing the particles directly. Rather, we're seeing electrons they create inside individual pixels as they are moving through the bulk of the sensor material, where they undergo collisions and spawn secondary or tertiary particles and interact with other atoms. Which is presumably why the paths are so complex.
Thanks, as usual. I was disappointed that even the referenced
source for the image makes no mention of the streaks.
--
"To B̬̻̋̚o̞̮̚̚l̘̲̀᷾d̫͓᷅ͩḷ̯᷁ͮȳ͙᷊͠ Go......Beyond The F͇̤i̙̖e̤̟l̡͓d͈̹s̙͚ We Know."{ʲₒʰₙNYᵈₑᵉₚ}
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JohnD
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by JohnD » Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:06 pm
Yes, thank you, Chris!
Then some of the secondary particles will be lighter (electrons?) and low energy, so more easily curved by weaker magnetic fields?
John
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Chris Peterson
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by Chris Peterson » Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:19 pm
JohnD wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:06 pm
Yes, thank you, Chris!
Then some of the secondary particles will be lighter (electrons?) and low energy, so more easily curved by weaker magnetic fields?
John
The particles interact with atoms in the sensor, which can free up electrons (which is what fills up the pixels and gets read out as an image), and that interaction can alter the velocity of the particle (in the proper vector sense of "velocity"). There don't need to be any magnetic fields involved, although there may be. The velocity of charged particles is also affected by electric fields, of course.
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johnnydeep
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by johnnydeep » Mon Feb 19, 2024 5:16 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:19 pm
JohnD wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:06 pm
Yes, thank you, Chris!
Then some of the secondary particles will be lighter (electrons?) and low energy, so more easily curved by weaker magnetic fields?
John
The particles interact with atoms in the sensor, which can free up electrons (which is what fills up the pixels and gets read out as an image), and that interaction can alter the velocity of the particle (in the proper vector sense of "velocity"). There don't need to be any magnetic fields involved, although there may be. The velocity of charged particles is also affected by electric fields, of course.
And I'd think that any curvature we see in the "paths" of the effect of such a solar particle on the sensor could not be due to curvature in solar magnetic field lines simply because those field lines would be essentially straight over such a short distance (and likely hundreds of miles!)
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"To B̬̻̋̚o̞̮̚̚l̘̲̀᷾d̫͓᷅ͩḷ̯᷁ͮȳ͙᷊͠ Go......Beyond The F͇̤i̙̖e̤̟l̡͓d͈̹s̙͚ We Know."{ʲₒʰₙNYᵈₑᵉₚ}
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Chris Peterson
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by Chris Peterson » Mon Feb 19, 2024 5:19 pm
johnnydeep wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 5:16 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:19 pm
JohnD wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 3:06 pm
Yes, thank you, Chris!
Then some of the secondary particles will be lighter (electrons?) and low energy, so more easily curved by weaker magnetic fields?
John
The particles interact with atoms in the sensor, which can free up electrons (which is what fills up the pixels and gets read out as an image), and that interaction can alter the velocity of the particle (in the proper vector sense of "velocity"). There don't need to be any magnetic fields involved, although there may be. The velocity of charged particles is also affected by electric fields, of course.
And I'd think that any curvature we see in the "paths" of the effect of such a solar particle on the sensor could not be due to curvature in solar magnetic field lines simply because those field lines would be essentially straight over such a short distance (and likely hundreds of miles!)
Absolutely. If magnetic fields are involved, they are local to the camera and probe.
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AVAO
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by AVAO » Mon Feb 19, 2024 9:21 pm
Ann wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 6:05 am
There is a cluster in the very beginning of the video (at 2 seconds). Could this cluster be M11? What do you think?
APOD 19 February 2024 annotated.png
Ann
Hi Ann
Actually, I wouldn't have had the time this evening. But it was just too much fun.
Answering your question in 2D doesn't work.
Working with spherical projections would be too time-consuming for me.
That's why the sequence shown is only backed up with a panorama of the Milky Way, just 4 fun.
bigggg:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/185130090 ... 9/sizes/k/
jac berne (flickr)
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alter-ego
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by alter-ego » Tue Feb 20, 2024 12:46 am
Ann wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 6:05 am
There is a cluster in the very beginning of the video (at 2 seconds). Could this cluster be M11? What do you think?
APOD 19 February 2024 annotated.png
Ann
The cluster is M44.
Being near the ecliptic, it was easy to find. On the left is from Stellarium, and on the right is a snip from the "featured time-lapse video" link
A pessimist is nothing more than an experienced optimist
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tracyjohnson
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by tracyjohnson » Tue Feb 20, 2024 3:59 am
I've always admired that PSP can protect itself from the heat of the Sun, something many other robots cannot do
uno online
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Ann
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by Ann » Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:07 am
alter-ego wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2024 12:46 am
Ann wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 6:05 am
There is a cluster in the very beginning of the video (at 2 seconds). Could this cluster be M11? What do you think?
APOD 19 February 2024 annotated.png
Ann
The cluster is M44.
Being near the ecliptic, it was easy to find. On the left is from Stellarium, and on the right is a snip from the "featured time-lapse video" link
Parker Probe View of M44.png
Thanks, alter-ego!
Ann
Color Commentator