APOD: Car Orbiting Earth (2018 Feb 13)

[Boomer12k]

While hating to rain on Elon Musk's parade, I have to say that one thing this Falcon Heavy "demonstration launch" truly demonstrates is just how out of touch billionaires such as Musk are with the real world in which they live. Rather than sending his car into space, Musk could have sold it (for well over $100,000), donated the money to a tutoring program for disadvantaged kids in some inner city, and instead sent an equal weight of some inexpensive payload such as concrete into space. The gulf between the top 1 % and the rest of us apparently is just too wide for the Elon Musks of the world to bridge (or apparently even to see). Sad.

Look up....How much money does Elon Musk donate to charity.....
it is way more an 100,000....

:---[===] *

[chuckster]

Please, no more SpaceX stunts on APOD. Musk's SpaceX is business, not science, orientated. Keep this site's postings to its name sake, astronomy.

Yes, no more APOD support of rank commercialism in space. Logos on asteroid-mining vehicles are OK, etc. But Musk is going to feature a screenshot of the sportscar in an APOD website frame in his next Powerpoint presentation no doubt. An affirmation ? Say NO.

[chuckster]

I love following Elon and his exploits. I think he is an inspiration and has good motives. If this forum is expressing a crude voting process as to whether or not something like this is a good APOD, I am all for it. It was a very well-planned and beautifully executed example of astrophotography, and quite expensive and fortunate, to boot!

To the posters that think Elon should have donated his roadster to the poor, or that he is out of touch with the needs of humanity, or that our American billionaires are out of touch with the needs of the less fortunate, I think you have a lot of homework to do. Read up on the pledge, which Elon and many others have signed: http://www.kwiq.com/14-billionaires-sig ... ng-pledge/ That is just a starting point. Read up on the Gates Foundation. Read about what Elon Musk is doing and why. The suggestion that he should have donated his car to the poor is reminiscent of Judas criticizing Mary in John 12:5 .

One thing I'm concerned about with the rocket booster landings. They are fascinating to watch, a great technical achievement in aerodynamic control. But, as the core booster proved, they are somewhat dangerous. According to Mr. Musk, the video for the core booster is unavailable because it hit the water at around 300 mph and wiped out parts on the drone ship it was to land on (video may be recovered later). I'm really glad it was a drone ship and nobody was on board. I'm even more glad it wasn't one of the other boosters that had a problem coming into the landing areas on land. Currently, I would vote for only doing these onto drone ships that are on the water. (I also wonder why they can't be brought back more as gliders, rather than precision-guided spears, but that idea may not prove ultimately safer or more feasible.)

Regardless of what documents the "charitable" 1% have signed, the effort in space should suffer no egotistical fools. The car is being portrayed as a playful, astonishing and admirable feat by a young etrepreneur making his high-profile mark in his chosen field. Advertising efforts are ALWAYS "very well-planned and beautifully executed". But they're still just advertising. As an American watching the privatization of prisons and governments, and a veteran of 10,000 commercials, I know a 1%'er hiking a hind leg to mark their territory when I see it. So should you.
Their opportunity is to make a profit in space-based operations, which I support. Making space profitable does not need the support of people impressed by rank stunts. If it does, they're trying to get favorable votes when the laws start being passed, and those votes will be for the same wrong reasons America is suffering from right now. If Neil Armstrong had planted Old Glory on the Moon with a JP Morgan Chase logo on it, that would be OK with you ? We came in peace for all mankind. We should economize space travel and mine asteroids and go to Mars for all mankind, also. Not some businessman's ego.
On the way out of Earth's atmosphere, check your advertising at the door, please.

[Victor Buonadonna]

Does anyone see the connection between this image and the opening scenes in the anime cult movie "Heavy Metal"?

[MarkBour]

. . .

Regardless of what documents the "charitable" 1% have signed, the effort in space should suffer no egotistical fools. The car is being portrayed as a playful, astonishing and admirable feat by a young etrepreneur making his high-profile mark in his chosen field. Advertising efforts are ALWAYS "very well-planned and beautifully executed". But they're still just advertising. As an American watching the privatization of prisons and governments, and a veteran of 10,000 commercials, I know a 1%'er hiking a hind leg to mark their territory when I see it. So should you.
Their opportunity is to make a profit in space-based operations, which I support. Making space profitable does not need the support of people impressed by rank stunts. If it does, they're trying to get favorable votes when the laws start being passed, and those votes will be for the same wrong reasons America is suffering from right now. If Neil Armstrong had planted Old Glory on the Moon with a JP Morgan Chase logo on it, that would be OK with you ? We came in peace for all mankind. We should economize space travel and mine asteroids and go to Mars for all mankind, also. Not some businessman's ego.
On the way out of Earth's atmosphere, check your advertising at the door, please.

Peace, brother! Although I personally don't feel the same, you're welcome to be as suspicious of Musk's motives as you wish.

As to some of the deeper points you are making, I wholeheartedly support them. You ended your post with: "On the way out of Earth's atmosphere, check your advertising at the door, please." I would also wish we could leave our symbols of national pride out of space as well. It seems the most productive place for this discussion would be the United Nations. As you quoted, "We came in peace for all mankind". That seems the best sentiment, to me.

[RJN]

Does anyone see the connection between this image and the opening scenes in the anime cult movie "Heavy Metal"?

Yes. Please check the links to see this video and a modern re-make.

[geckzilla]

As you quoted, "We came in peace for all mankind". That seems the best sentiment, to me.

Works for the human males, anyway.

[Stinky]

As you quoted, "We came in peace for all mankind". That seems the best sentiment, to me.

Works for the human males, anyway.

mankind -
1. The human race in its entirety.
2. Men collectively, as opposed to all women.
3. (obsolete) Human feelings; humanity.

womankind -
1. Women, taken collectively.

humankind -
1. The human race; mankind, humanity; Homo sapiens.

personkind -
1. People as a whole.

pedantic seMANtics

[geckzilla]

As you quoted, "We came in peace for all mankind". That seems the best sentiment, to me.

Works for the human males, anyway.

mankind -
1. The human race in its entirety.
2. Men collectively, as opposed to all women.
3. (obsolete) Human feelings; humanity.

womankind -
1. Women, taken collectively.

humankind -
1. The human race; mankind, humanity; Homo sapiens.

personkind -
1. People as a whole.

pedantic seMANtics

I've all but given up on the insistence that "mankind" and "all men" refer, with human male as the default entity, to all people. I couldn't resist the urge to push the topic even further after it'd already gone from "no logos" to "no flags or nations, either". I'll see your anti-capitalist, anti-nationalist sentiment and raise you some anti-sexism. Later on, an artificial intelligence will let us know that we're still excluding them with this lifeist speech.

[MarkBour]

I'll see your anti-capitalist, anti-nationalist sentiment and raise you some anti-sexism. Later on, an artificial intelligence will let us know that we're still excluding them with this lifeist speech.

LOL! Bionist? Anti-siliconist?

This discussion caused me to read the Wikipedia article on Space Law: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_law . So now I know at least a little about what actually has been addressed and what is ongoing.

[Nitpicker]

The big black rectangular prisms from Space Odyssey 2001, were actually test payloads from a long forgotten and now extinct species, with little sense of nationalism or commercialism.

No future being will ever find humanity to have been similarly lacking.

This little human was waving to the camera in this APOD. However flawed we are as a species, I thought it was a cool stunt within an important test flight.

[chuckster]

. . .

Regardless of what documents the "charitable" 1% have signed, the effort in space should suffer no egotistical fools. The car is being portrayed as a playful, astonishing and admirable feat by a young etrepreneur making his high-profile mark in his chosen field. Advertising efforts are ALWAYS "very well-planned and beautifully executed". But they're still just advertising. As an American watching the privatization of prisons and governments, and a veteran of 10,000 commercials, I know a 1%'er hiking a hind leg to mark their territory when I see it. So should you.
Their opportunity is to make a profit in space-based operations, which I support. Making space profitable does not need the support of people impressed by rank stunts. If it does, they're trying to get favorable votes when the laws start being passed, and those votes will be for the same wrong reasons America is suffering from right now. If Neil Armstrong had planted Old Glory on the Moon with a JP Morgan Chase logo on it, that would be OK with you ? We came in peace for all mankind. We should economize space travel and mine asteroids and go to Mars for all mankind, also. Not some businessman's ego.
On the way out of Earth's atmosphere, check your advertising at the door, please.

Peace, brother! Although I personally don't feel the same, you're welcome to be as suspicious of Musk's motives as you wish.

As to some of the deeper points you are making, I wholeheartedly support them. You ended your post with: "On the way out of Earth's atmosphere, check your advertising at the door, please." I would also wish we could leave our symbols of national pride out of space as well. It seems the most productive place for this discussion would be the United Nations. As you quoted, "We came in peace for all mankind". That seems the best sentiment, to me.

Peace to you also, brother. Here we are on the APOD discussion board ! I'm not some contrary hothead dimbulb (at least I like to think not), and as far as this sportscar stunt, I actually think I'm in the minority, and the inevitable is coming. I visit other forums, and Musk is pretty much universally the darling of people around his age, and others. The commercialization of space is a good idea, in theory, just like Capitalism. But you know how that goes. I also agree with your "symbols of national pride" caveat, which seems to be a hangover from the Cold War moon landings. We all know why the Fed money flowed for that effort, and national pride is what seemed the most natural reaction at the time. But if we're opening up space, we should take the ISS as the new example of how to go forward, ideologically. We want to be proud of HUMAN efforts in space.

I've spent so many lunch hours and home hours reading APODs and following the links, where APOD brings the wonder -and reverence- for the discovery and application of astrophysical law to observations, that the Tesla with a mannequin seemed to be sacrilege in a cathedral to me. The caption to the photo was basically neutral, which I appreciated. Thanks for your measured reply !

[Oldironsides]

I thrilled at the excellent video coverage of Elon Musk's Falcon Heavy rocket and the deployment of his red Tesla Roadster into an extended orbit beyond Mars. Am I the only one to note the irony of this fantastic event? Recall back in 1977 the launch of two Voyager space craft which are now the furthest objects sent away from Earth. Do you remember the elaborate package of audio/visual introductions that was included in case they were recovered by some intelligent life forms? Greetings from planet Earth! I can't stop wondering what some other intelligent life form would think if they ever found that shiny red convertible flying through space with a mannequin dressed up in a space suit.

[Chris Peterson]

Am I the only one to note the irony of this fantastic event? Recall back in 1977 the launch of two Voyager space craft which are now the furthest objects sent away from Earth. Do you remember the elaborate package of audio/visual introductions that was included in case they were recovered by some intelligent life forms? Greetings from planet Earth! I can't stop wondering what some other intelligent life form would think if they ever found that shiny red convertible flying through space with a mannequin dressed up in a space suit.

Well, yes, that would certainly be an odd thing to find. Of course, the Voyager spacecraft were launched with speeds greater than the solar escape velocity, so they will eventually leave the Solar System and make it to other star systems. Musk's Tesla is nowhere near fast enough to do that. It's in a closed solar orbit, so the only way it would ever be found by aliens would be if they had already arrived here. Perhaps their thinking would be along the lines of "Well, if this is the sort of craziness they engaged in, we understand why they went extinct!"

[bjorkk]

extraterestrial alien are requested to recover car and return it to the earth

??

why do supposedly people smart people carry out silly things like this

[neufer]

why do supposedly people smart people carry out silly things like this

• Considering our insignificance in the Universe everything we do is either silly or pathetic.

<<silly (adj.) Old English gesælig "happy, fortuitous, prosperous" (related to sæl "happiness"), from Proto-Germanic *sæligas (source also of Old Norse sæll "happy," Old Saxon salig, Middle Dutch salich, Old High German salig, German selig "blessed, happy, blissful," Gothic sels "good, kindhearted"), from PIE *sele- "of good mood; to favor," from root *sel- (2) "happy, of good mood; to favor" (source also of Latin solari "to comfort," Greek hilaros "cheerful, gay, merry, joyous"). The word's considerable sense development moved from "happy" to "blessed" to "pious," to "innocent" (c. 1200), to "harmless," to "pitiable" (late 13c.), "weak" (c. 1300), to "feeble in mind, lacking in reason, foolish" (1570s). Further tendency toward "stunned, dazed as by a blow" (1886) in knocked silly, etc. Silly season in journalism slang is from 1861 (August and September, when newspapers compensate for a lack of hard news by filling up with trivial stories).>>

[rstevenson]

why do supposedly people smart people carry out silly things like this

• Considering our insignificance in the Universe everything we do is either silly or pathetic. ...

Or art.

Rob

[neufer]

why do supposedly people smart people carry out silly things like this

• Considering our insignificance in the Universe everything we do is either silly or pathetic. ...

Or art.

• Right...Art is BOTH silly AND pathetic.

[starr struk]

placing a car and dummy in orbit above rhe earth was the nineteenth most silliest most stupidest undertaking in known history

extraterestrial alien are called upon to collect space junk and return it the earth for recycling

[neufer]

placing a car and dummy in orbit above rhe earth was the nineteenth most silliest most stupidest undertaking in known history

extraterestrial alien are called upon to collect space junk and return it the earth for recycling

On the plus side: if it looks like the Tesla Roadster will collide with Earth
Musk only has to send up an astronaut driver to drive it out of harm's way.

<<Elon Musk's Tesla Roadster is an electric sports car that served as the dummy payload for the February 2018 Falcon Heavy test flight and became an artificial satellite of the Sun. "Starman", a mannequin dressed in a spacesuit, occupies the driver's seat. In August 2019, as the Roadster completed its first orbit around the Sun, Musk stated that SpaceX may one day launch a small spacecraft to catch up with the Roadster and take photographs.

Simulations over a 3-million-year timespan found a probability of the Roadster colliding with Earth at approximately 6%, or with Venus at approximately 2.5%. These probabilities of collision are similar to those of other near-Earth objects. The half-life for the tested orbits was calculated as approximately 20 million years, but with trajectories varying significantly following a close approach to the Earth–Moon system in 2091.

Musk had originally speculated that the car could drift in space for a billion years. According to chemist William Carroll, solar radiation, cosmic radiation, and micrometeoroid impacts will structurally damage the car over time. Radiation will eventually break down any material with carbon–carbon bonds, including carbon fiber parts. Tires, paint, plastic and leather might last only about a year, while carbon fiber parts will last considerably longer. Eventually, only the aluminum frame, inert metals, and glass not shattered by meteoroids will remain.>>