Where am I?

[Ann]

Click to view full size image

Odysseus and the Sirens. Intarsia 19th century. Museo Correale di Terranova, Sorrento.

Kirk and Bones have learnt from Odysseus. Let someone else steer the ship while you enjoy the dangerous fun.


Ann

[Beyond]

Hmm... this would seem to be a 'Trojan' clue.

[MargaritaMc]

Hmm... this would seem to be a 'Trojan' clue.

I don't think that Ann has set another puzzle - it is an erudite comment on the joke I posted about the StarTrek crew driving through the boozy cloud! Odysseus had himself tied to the mast so that the voices of the sirens couldn't lure him to his death. Kirk however had Spock to do the driving!
Margarita

[Beyond]

Well, see It was a Trojan clue after all. It had nothing to do with a puzzle, but was a pictorial comment.

[Ann]

Maybe I should set a new puzzle, then? Okay! An Odysseus-related one.

This celestial giant was first spotted by Odysseus, at which time the giant was in the underworld!

Ann

[Beyond]

Hercules.

[Ann]

I could find no connection between Odysseus and Hercules, apart from this one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odysseus wrote:
It was later learned that the war could not be won without the poisonous arrows of Heracles, which were owned by the abandoned Philoctetes.

Hercules is not the correct answer.

However....

Here's a hint. You can read about the alpha star of the Hercules constellation, if you follow the link. So... does the alpha star of constellation Hercules remind you of another famous star? Hmmmm?

Ann

[Beyond]

Odysseus first met Hercules in the underworld. Did tooooo much reading in tooooo many places to be able to tell you where to find it.
So naturally, i thought you were referring to the constellation of Hercules.

The Alpha star of the constellation Hercules doesn't remind me of anything.
Guess I'll have to wait for the next clue and/or the space brains to make an appearance.

[Ann]

Beyond wrote:
Odysseus first met Hercules in the underworld.

He did? Where did you read that?

Ann

[stephen63]

It reminds me of Albireo, in that the larger star in the double is red and the smaller is blue, not very common.

[Ann]

Good observation, Stephen, but Albireo is not the correct answer.

The famous star I'm referring to is in fact double, and the colors really resemble the colors of Alpha Herculis. However, the famous star I'm talking about isn't well known as a double star. Only the primary component is well known... and that component is well known! I'll say!

But I'm not really asking for the star, but rather for the constellation where you find the star. On the other hand, if you have identified the star, you will have no trouble identifying the constellation!

Ann

[Ann]

No? Still too hard?

Well, the famous star I'm asking for, that resembles Alpha Herculis except that this other star isn't really known as a double star (although it is), is the alpha star of its famous constellation in the same way as Alpha Herculis is the alpha star of constellation Hercules.

C'mon! Take a look at Alpha Herculis again. For example, what is its spectral class? How many other famous stars do you know that share this spectral class?

Ann

[Beyond]

Beyond wrote:
Odysseus first met Hercules in the underworld.

He did? Where did you read that?

Ann

http://suite101.com/article/greek-myth- ... ld-a198557

[Beyond]

Ann, i don't get into things like spectral classes and the like. That's for someone with a "space-brain", which i don't have.

However, isn't there a really well known, really big star in Orion's sword that looks a little orange-ish? Don't remember the name. Maybe starts with an -A- ?

[stephen63]

I looked up the 50 brightest stars in the sky. Only three are M class. Betelgeuse, Antares, and Gacrux.
Betelgeuse isn't a double, and isn't even the brightest star in Orion.
Who cares about Gacrux, I've never even heard of it.
Antares IS a double. It is in the constellation of Scorpius. Although I could find no reference to Odysseus.

As a side note: I was binocular stargazing last night and darned if I wasn't ticked off by the time I finished. Why? Because one of my favorite constellations to look at is Scorpius because it has so many nice objects. The reason I was ticked is because from where I live, the light pollution ruins that part of the sky.

Edit: So, Scorpius?
Edit again: Oops, Betelgeuse IS Alpha Orionis, but not a double.

[MargaritaMc]

Both Betelgeuse and Antares are M class stars (but not M0) and are the alpha stars of their respective constellations.
After that I fall silent! Especially as I've just seen that Stephen has just posted - and mentioned a star I've never heard of. And, yes, we too are wall-to-wall cloud and have been for weeks. Stars? What are they?
Margarita

[MargaritaMc]

EUREKA!

From Wikipedia

Orion is mentioned in the oldest surviving works of Greek literature, which probably date back to the 7th or 8th century BC, but which are the products of an oral tradition with origins several centuries earlier. In Homer's Iliad Orion is described as a constellation, and the star Sirius is mentioned as his dog.[3] In the Odyssey, Odysseus sees him hunting in the underworld with a bronze club, a great slayer of animals;

So the answer is Betelgeuse! Ah, but - ¿a double?
M

[stephen63]

EUREKA!

From Wikipedia

Orion is mentioned in the oldest surviving works of Greek literature, which probably date back to the 7th or 8th century BC, but which are the products of an oral tradition with origins several centuries earlier. In Homer's Iliad Orion is described as a constellation, and the star Sirius is mentioned as his dog.[3] In the Odyssey, Odysseus sees him hunting in the underworld with a bronze club, a great slayer of animals;

So the answer is Betelgeuse! Ah, but - ¿a double?
M

Margarita, I think you're right. Almost. Ann wanted the constellation the star was in. So.............

[Beyond]

So Orion was killing -dead- animals in the underworld with a bronze club. What a mighty man

[MargaritaMc]

Found it!!

Oh, Star Lady Ann -- SNEAKY!  And very clever!

http://www.starobserver.eu/multiplestar ... geuse.html

Betelgeuse’s exact angular diameter remains a mystery. This is because it is a variable star, shows limb darkening and angular diameters that vary with wavelength. What makes things even more complicating is the fact that Betelgeuse has a complex assymetric envelope caused my severe mass loss involving huge plumes of gas being expelled from it’s surface. Some studies even speak of stellar companions, orbiting within the gaseous envelopes, which would contribute to the red giant’s eccentric behaviour.*

Margarita

*Possibly even to his penchant for slaughtering (dead?) beasties, Beyond!

[Ann]

Thanks, Margarita, but I made a mistake. Stephen is right, Antares is the obvious double star, the red supergiant with a small blue companion that you can spot with a telescope. The companions of Betelgeuse are unresolvable in any telescope, and can only be detected spectroscopically.

Click to view full size image

But Margarita, you won! Have a sort of Betelgeuse-colored flower!


Ann

[Beyond]

Well, now that that's over, i gotta go finish cutting grass before it rains tonight, in the overworld.

[MargaritaMc]

Thank you for the flowers, Ann - I'll split them with Stephen!

I've found this on Wikipedia - and, partly because it's really interesting and partly because of the name of the researcher , I'm posting the whole section!

In 1985, Margarita Karovska, in conjunction with other astrophysicists at the Harvard–Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, announced the discovery of two close companions orbiting Betelgeuse. Analysis of polarization data from 1968 through 1983 indicated a close companion with a periodic orbit of about 2.1 years. Using speckle interferometry, the team concluded that the closer of the two companions was located at 0.06 ± 0.01" (~9 AU) from the main star with a position angle (PA) of 273 degrees, an orbit that would potentially place it within the star's chromosphere. The more distant companion was estimated at 0.51 ± 0.01" (~77 AU) with a PA of 278 degrees.[123][124]

In the years that followed no confirmation of Karovska's discovery was published. In 1992, a team of collaborators from the Cavendish Astrophysics Group questioned the finding. They published a paper noting that the brightness features on the surface of Betelgeuse appear to be "too bright to be associated with a passage of the suggested companions in front of the red giant." They also noticed that these features were fainter at 710 nanometers compared to 700 by a factor of 1.8, indicating that such features would have to reside within the molecular atmosphere of the star.[125] Despite this, that same year Karovska published a new paper reconfirming her team's exegesis, but also noting that there was a meaningful correlation between the calculated position angles of the orbiting companion and the reported asymmetries, suggesting a possible connection between the two.[126] Since then, researchers have turned their attention to analyzing the intricate dynamics of the star's extended atmosphere and little else has been published on the possibility of orbiting companions, although as Xavier Haubois and his team reiterate in 2009, the possibility of a close companion contributing to the overall flux has never been fully ruled out.[78]Dommanget's double star catalog (CCDM) lists at least four adjacent stars, all within three arcminutes of this stellar giant, yet aside from apparent magnitudes and position angles, little else is known.[127]

Margarita

[MargaritaMc]

The opposed locations of Orion and Scorpio, with their corresponding bright variable red stars Betelgeuse and Antares, were noted by ancient cultures around the world. The setting of Orion and rising of Scorpio signify the death of Orion by the scorpion. In China they signify brothers and rivals Shen and Shang.[22] The Batak of Sumatra marked their New Year with the first new moon after the sinking of Orion's Belt below the horizon, at which point Betelgeuse remained "like the tail of a rooster". The positions of Betelgeuse and Antares at opposite ends of the celestial sky were considered significant and their constellations were seen as a pair of scorpions. Scorpion days marked as nights that both constellations could be seen.

More from good old Wikipedia - just because I have an addiction for intriguing facts. Here again, as in your puzzle, Ann, Antares and Betelgeuse are seen as connected/contrasted.
M
Quotations in both posts from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betelgeuse

[stephen63]

Thank you for the flowers, Ann - I'll split them with Stephen!

I've found this on Wikipedia - and, partly because it's really interesting and partly because of the name of the researcher , I'm posting the whole section!

In 1985, Margarita Karovska, in conjunction with other astrophysicists at the Harvard–Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, announced the discovery of two close companions orbiting Betelgeuse. Analysis of polarization data from 1968 through 1983 indicated a close companion with a periodic orbit of about 2.1 years. Using speckle interferometry, the team concluded that the closer of the two companions was located at 0.06 ± 0.01" (~9 AU) from the main star with a position angle (PA) of 273 degrees, an orbit that would potentially place it within the star's chromosphere. The more distant companion was estimated at 0.51 ± 0.01" (~77 AU) with a PA of 278 degrees.[123][124]

In the years that followed no confirmation of Karovska's discovery was published. In 1992, a team of collaborators from the Cavendish Astrophysics Group questioned the finding. They published a paper noting that the brightness features on the surface of Betelgeuse appear to be "too bright to be associated with a passage of the suggested companions in front of the red giant." They also noticed that these features were fainter at 710 nanometers compared to 700 by a factor of 1.8, indicating that such features would have to reside within the molecular atmosphere of the star.[125] Despite this, that same year Karovska published a new paper reconfirming her team's exegesis, but also noting that there was a meaningful correlation between the calculated position angles of the orbiting companion and the reported asymmetries, suggesting a possible connection between the two.[126] Since then, researchers have turned their attention to analyzing the intricate dynamics of the star's extended atmosphere and little else has been published on the possibility of orbiting companions, although as Xavier Haubois and his team reiterate in 2009, the possibility of a close companion contributing to the overall flux has never been fully ruled out.[78]Dommanget's double star catalog (CCDM) lists at least four adjacent stars, all within three arcminutes of this stellar giant, yet aside from apparent magnitudes and position angles, little else is known.[127]

Margarita

Interesting. I've never heard the term exegesis used in that context before. Perhaps that announcement was her was work on a PhD?