UnMeta Comments (split: Provocative Title (MetaThread))

[Ann]

http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 23&t=21646

Wow. I've been scratching my head as I've been reading this thread. What the heck is it all about?

As a teacher, I get a vague sense of uneasiness reading it. If this kind of talk happened in a class, I would immediately suspect that a group of students were bullying another student. By talking what appeared to be nonsense in a very pointed way, by immediately picking up the slack if the spouting of nonsense seemed to stop, by demonstrating so clearly that they are "in the know" and some other persons aren't, they would seem to demonstrate not only that they are superior to others, but also that anyone who doesn't understand what all this is about should start worrying, now, that they are the ones being talked about.

Well. Once I was told off by Owlice for spending many paragraphs discussing the typical qualities of K0III stars and why I find such stars boring. My post was born out of my enthusiasm for stars and my consequent need to share my knowledge about stars and my different preferences for different kind of stars.

Okay. I was, perhaps, bullying a star, but I sure wasn't bullying a person. I didn't, of course, intend to bully the poor K0 star, if said K0 star was indeed capable of feeling bullied.

I don't think this thread has been meant as a bullying thread either. But I am not sure. In any case, I think my post about the K0 star was more interesting than this thread has been, even though it has run to two pages. But maybe that's just me.

I want to thank bystander and hstarbuck for echoing my confusion about the purpose of this thread.

Ann

[rstevenson]

The key in understanding this thread is the word "meta". It means (in this usage): "referring to itself or to the conventions of its genre; self-referential."

In other words, this thread can be seen as a humerous, ironic thread obliquely referencing other threads which may have been anything but humerous or ironic. I suspect this thread would be more amusing the more experience one has in multiple on-line forums. It's not about any one person, post or thread -- here or elsewhere -- but rather is about the difficulties sometimes encountered in these sorts of forums.

It can certainly make for edgy reading. I'm pretty sure I and a post I had just made was referenced in one of these posts, immediately after I had made the other post. But that sort of thinking spirals rapidly into paranoia, so I didn't fuss about it, if indeed my reading of the possible rebuke was correct. That sort of self-doubt -- are they talking about me??? -- is one of the fun things about this thread. As a CBC announcer said a few years ago in reference to some quite abstract modern music, "It's very meta, meta, meta."

Rob

[bystander]

Ann, for reference, see: Wiki: metalanguage and http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 31#p135031

As Rob stated, the posts are not about any one post or poster. If, however, you recognize yourself in any of the posts, rather than taking offense, you should, perhaps, think about what it was about yourself you recognized and why you were offended.

[emc]

Ann, for reference, see: Wiki: metalanguage and http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 31#p135031

As Rob stated, the posts are not about any one post or poster. If, however, you recognize yourself in any of the posts, rather than taking offense, you should, perhaps, think about what it was about yourself you recognized and why you were offended.

It worked for me. I removed the link to my personal website since it had little to do with astronomy. I decided that if people want to know about me they will send me a PM.

[Ann]

Ann, for reference, see: Wiki: metalanguage and http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 31#p135031

As Rob stated, the posts are not about any one post or poster. If, however, you recognize yourself in any of the posts, rather than taking offense, you should, perhaps, think about what it was about yourself you recognized and why you were offended.

Thanks, bystander. No, frankly, I didn't recognize myself. I don't support "alternative" theories and don't post "strange" links. I don't claim that "alternative experts" are experts just because they are "alternative". So, frankly, no, I don't recognize myself. In my post, I didn't say that I recognized myself, either.

I have nothing further to say about this, although I will appreciate it if you will mail me and tell me if you think that the meta thread applies to me.

Ann

[bystander]

Ed, I doubt that anything was aimed at you and your personal link was unobtrusive.

[owlice]

Ann,

My only nod to anyone other than myself on the meta thread was the post about mushrooms, and that a tribute to a mind I admire in its ability to make connections rather than anything mean-spirited.

Instead of accusing everyone who posted on that thread of bullying someone/others when you didn't even understand what was going on, why didn't you just ask what the thread was about?

[emc]

I didn’t ask because I like challenges. And I’m a guy. Guy’s like to think they know everything already. Just ask.

I’m still leaving my website link out of SA*… unless it evolves into more about astronomy and less about me. I don’t want the moderators mad at me. They don’t use spoons.

[makc]

 

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[Ann]

Geckzilla, makc, JeanTate, Rob, BMAONE123, RJN, Art, hstarbuck: I must apologize to you if a post I made about bullying made it appear as if I thought that you were guilty of any sort of bullying.

Please accept my apologies.

Ann

[emc]

Ann,

I think they would have let you know if they were offended in any way. I like your posts, they are fun and enlightening to read. I'm glad you're here! You know quite a lot about stars.

[rstevenson]

I took no offense Ann. You're far too nice a color commentator to offend.

Rob

[Ann]

Thank you very much, Ed and Rob!

Ann

[neufer]

Neufer Post # 4321

<<A countdown is a sequence of counting backward to indicate the seconds, days, or other time units remaining before an event occurs or a deadline expires. Typical events for which a countdown is used include the launch of a rocket or spacecraft, the detonation of a bomb, the start of a race, and the start of the New Year.

The first known use of a countdown for a rocket launch occurred in Fritz Lang's 1929 film Frau im Mond.
In the film, after each number the words "seconds to go" was repeated.

Click to play embedded YouTube video.

Click to play embedded YouTube video.

At the start of films, a countdown sequence is printed on the head leader, to aid in synchronizing the film. In film (but not television) the countdown is in units of feet rather than time units. The countdown ends just as "two" is displayed so that the countdown isn't shown if the film is put on screen a little earlier than intended. Although this sequence was usually not intended for broadcast, being a cue device for a projectionist or TV producer, it is sometimes used in modern-day spoofs to signify old film footage.

When counting down to the launch of an explosive, e.g. when testing a new model of gun, it is customary to omit "5" from the countdown sequence because "five" sounds too similar to 'Fire!'.
-----------------------------------------------------
A countdown is a carefully devised set of procedures ending with the ignition of a rocket's engine. Depending on the type of vehicle used, countdowns can start from 72 to 96 hours prior to launch time.

During countdown:

* Aerospace personnel bring the rocket vehicle to the launch site and load it with payload and propellants;

* Launch-center computers communicate with sensors in the rocket, which monitor important systems on the launch vehicle and payload;

* Launch personnel monitor the weather and wait for the launch window;

* Security personnel prevent unauthorized persons from entering the "keep-out" area.

The procedures for each launch are written carefully. For the Space Shuttle, a five-volume set, Shuttle Countdown (KSC S0007), often referred to as "S0007", is used. Rosie Carver, a technical writer for United Launch Alliance, has created at least 15,000 procedures for more than 300 missions since the Solar Maximum Mission, which launched Feb. 14, 1980. These documents are living documents, which reflect new issues and solutions as they develop. Each mission requires approximately 100 procedure books.

Proceeding with the countdown depends on several factors, such as the proper launch window,
weather that permits a safe launch, and the rocket and payload working properly.

A hold is the suspension of the normal countdown process.
This can be done to investigate a technical process that has gone wrong, or because of marginal weather at the launch pad.

Some holds are planned: they are done so the launch-support computers can run automatic checks on the rocket.

Under some circumstances, a countdown may be recycled to an earlier time.
When that happens, launch personnel begin following the countdown checklist from the earlier point.

In the context of a rocket launch, the "T minus Time" is the time before launch, e.g. "T minus 3 minutes and 40 seconds". The last ten seconds are usually counted down aloud "10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, Lift off!" After a launch, most countdown clocks begin to show Mission Elapsed Time, which is typically shown as "T plus." The picture to the right shows "+ 00:00:00:07", approximately seven seconds after liftoff.>>

[orin stepanek]

Meta Thread = Hitching Post; I mean Bitching Post A place to vent frustration? I guess i'm a litttle confused about the meaning!!

[BMAONE23]

Meta Thread = Hitching Post; I mean Bitching Post A place to vent frustration? I guess i'm a litttle confused about the meaning!!

I never MetaThread I didn't like

[Beyond]

GADS
I'm GLAD that's over!!
I didn't get what was going on at all, but when i got to the Polar Bears reaction to what the 'Humans' were doing, i started to laugh!
I must say that i agree with the Polar Bear

[BMAONE23]

Geckzilla, makc, JeanTate, Rob, BMAONE123, RJN, Art, hstarbuck: I must apologize to you if a post I made about bullying made it appear as if I thought that you were guilty of any sort of bullying.

Please accept my apologies.

Ann

Sorry Ann,
I've been off line for a while. Totally missed your post. I took the MetaThread to be of a humorous nature. One that, in the spirit of fun, did not seek to offend other posters through ridicule but rather sought to flatter them through mimicry. I for one was never offended by anything in your statements and, although I will graciously accept your appologies, I personally feel they are not needed.

I admire anyone with a passion. You are no exception but are in fact exceptional in your admiration of stars (blue or otherwise)

Try not to get K.O.'d by KO stars though, It could severely limit your viewing time

[owlice]

I took the MetaThread to be of a humorous nature.

Exactly. The meta-thread was intended to be fun, and that Ann should take it as she did and accuse everyone on it of bullying someone ...! I'm glad she apologized to some. She obviously was not the only one puzzled by it.

I've never seen a meta-thread not work on a board; on every board I've seen one on, the thread was very popular and wildly funny. I don't quite know what to think about it not working here, about others taking such sharp offense at it. 'tis a puzzlement to me.

[Ann]

I took the MetaThread to be of a humorous nature.

Exactly. The meta-thread was intended to be fun, and that Ann should take it as she did and accuse everyone on it of bullying someone ...! I'm glad she apologized to some.

Again, I'm sorry that I ruined the fun. And this is the last time I apologize.

Ann

[Beyond]

I just went back and perused the original MetaThread and it's now a bit easier to see that you were all 'bandying' back and forth in a certain way about certain topics in general without asking or answering any questions.
Well, i have one question. How did it start?? Was it just what owlice said and you all caught on and chimed in, or did you PM each other before-hand to what was going to take place? Or was it just one of those rare things that happens that's just un-X-plane-able??

[owlice]

The title of the thread ("Provocative Title") should have been a tip-off, since the title is non-specific -- a meta (or generic) title, rather than anything specific. I added "MetaThread" in what I thought was an abundance of caution to help those unfamiliar with this type of thread. My opening post is also generic -- I don't mention any specific "alternative theory" nor which "two or three government agencies" are supposedly colluding. And so on. So far as I know, no one PMed anyone. I would expect that those with a good bit of experience with message boards would have either run across a similar thread or at least read one of the many sites that discuss discussions and so would have understood, and that those who hadn't run across such threads/didn't have a lot of experience with message boards would likely catch on after a few posts.

Obviously, I was wrong. Not the first time that's happened, and certainly not the last, darn it!

[rstevenson]

I had never seen such a thread before, but immediately saw the purpose and spirit of it. I found it hilarious. Of course I might have been helped by close knowledge of the art world around the late 60s and throughout the 70s, when being meta was absolutely necessary -- for a certain class of artists, at a few schools frequented by a certain few guest professors. Then and there irony was equated with clarity, and opaque writing with subtlety.

Rob

[Beyond]

Thanks Owlice. I've never heard of that before and still don't really know what it means. For some reason it just doesn't seem to want to sink in.Oh-well, i am from BEYONDER LAND, you know and there is nothing like that going on there. So just keep at it and maybe eventually a lot more will catch on that aren't used to such a thing and next thing you know it might turn into a Mega-Meta party!

[owlice]

I found it hilarious.

This! Threads I've seen on other boards have not only been funny, they went on for many pages, sometimes for many months and even years, and long after the threads have ended, they are remembered fondly by board members. I've even seen "Son of Meta Thread" threads pop up, and they proved as popular as the original. A lot of fun, these! I'd hoped for the same here. I'm glad you found the thread hilarious!

Rob, I loved the "it's very meta, meta, meta" comment you quoted; do you happen to remember which composition inspired it?

Beyond, you might want to give a listen to "Title of the Song," which I posted on the "How's your day" thread. If you think of just about any "behaved badly so lost my girl" song, you'll see how under whatever phrases are used in the song, they are all pretty much the same. "Title of the Song" is the meta version of such songs. Many of the comments for the YouTube video are also meta.

http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 31#p135031