Cydonia and Shroud of Turin Faces

[Alex]

I recently saw a TV documentary about the face on the Shroud of Turin and wondered if there could possibly be points of similarity with the Cydonia 'face'. I selected a Wikipedia 'Jesus' image and combined it with an APOD image of the 'face on Mars'. The result is either remarkable, or not, depending on the viewer's inclination; after all, a face is a face is a face. Alex

[rstevenson]

So you took an on-line illustration of what are no doubt fake stains on an ancient piece of cloth, and you compared them to a picture of a landform on another planet? What next -- a potato?

Rob

[Alex]

I will look closely at each spud next time I restock my potato bin.

[wonderboy]

Ah well, worth a try eh Alex, it doesnt really fit if you look at it.


Paul

[neufer]

<<Pareidolia is a psychological phenomenon involving a vague and random stimulus (often an image or sound) being perceived as significant. Common examples include seeing images of animals or faces in clouds, the man in the moon, and hearing hidden messages on records played in reverse. The word comes from the Greek para- ("beside", "with", or "alongside"—meaning, in this context, something faulty or wrong (as in paraphasia, disordered speech)) and eidolon ("image"; the diminutive of eidos ("image", "form", "shape")). Pareidolia is a type of apophenia.

Carl Sagan hypothesized that as a survival technique, human beings are "hard-wired" from birth to identify the human face. This allows people to use only minimal details to recognize faces from a distance and in poor visibility but can also lead them to interpret random images or patterns of light and shade as being faces.



A 2009 magnetoencephalography study found that objects incidentally perceived as faces evoke an early (165 ms) activation in the ventral fusiform cortex, at a time and location similar to that evoked by faces, whereas other common objects do not evoke such activation. This activation is similar to a slightly earlier peak at 130 ms seen for images of real faces. The authors suggest that face perception evoked by face-like objects is a relatively early process.>>

[Alex]

Art Neuendorffer provides a provocative analysis of the face-finding syndrome.
Art's logo also gave me an idea for a Cydonia-Newman image.
I'm still waiting for Rob to send me a potato.

Alex

[wonderboy]

Art Neuendorffer provides a provocative analysis of the face-finding syndrome.
Art's logo also gave me an idea for a Cydonia-Newman image.
I'm still waiting for Rob to send me a potato.

Alex

Ahhhhhhahahahahahaha, this is one of the funniest things ive read or seen on here lol.


Well done Alex, you just made my full day, and its been spent working for RBS on the phones, shockinly bad.


Paul.

[rstevenson]

I'm still waiting for Rob to send me a potato.

Sorry, I ate it. I feel positively transported.

Rob

[neufer]

Art Neuendorffer provides a provocative analysis of the face-finding syndrome.
Art's logo also gave me an idea for a Cydonia-Newman image.

___Newman________Neuman

<<From Homer onward, Athena's most common epithet is glaukopis (γλαυκώπις), which usually is translated as, bright-eyed or with gleaming eyes. The word is a combination of glaukos (γλαύκος, meaning gleaming, silvery, and later, bluish-green or gray) and ops (ώψ, eye, or sometimes, face).

It is interesting to note that glaux (γλαύξ, "owl") is from the same root, presumably because of the bird's own distinctive eyes. The bird which sees well in the night is closely associated with the goddess of wisdom: in archaic images, Athena is frequently depicted with an owl perched on her head. Unsurprisingly, the owl became a sort of Athenian mascot.

In a temple at Phrixa in Elis Athena was known as Cydonia.>>

[Alex]

Transforming Alfred E Neuman to Newman obviated my worry about artlessly associating Art Neuendorffer, whom I respect, with Alfred, who appears vacuous.
I now realize that icon Alfred has evolved beyond “What, me worry?” Looking behind the mask, I perceive the mind of Alfred - perhaps an apex of thought/consciousness.

Alfred E. NEUMAN > NEWMAN > NOOMAN > NOOMOON > NOOSPHERE
Admittedly, arriving at noosphere from neuman is somewhat incongruous, more like quantum entanglement than quantum jump . . . nevertheless . . .

Wikipedia informs us that . . . . Noosphere, according to the thought of Teilhard de Chardin, denotes the "sphere of human thought". The word is derived from the Greek nous ‘mind’ sphaira ‘sphere’, in lexical analogy to ‘atmosphere’ and ‘biosphere’. . .

For Teilhard, the noosphere emerges through and is constituted by the interaction of human minds. The noosphere has grown in step with the organization of the human mass in relation to itself as it populates the earth. As mankind organizes itself in more complex social networks, the higher the noosphere will grow in awareness. This is an extension of Teilhard's Law of Complexity/Consciousness, the law describing the nature of evolution in the universe. Teilhard argued that the noosphere is growing towards an even greater integration and unification, culminating in the Omega point, which he saw as the goal of history. The goal of history, then, is an apex of thought/consciousness.

[bystander]

But Art is Mad

[neufer]

But Art is Mad

• "`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
  
  `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
  
  `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
  
  `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  
  Alice didn't think that proved it at all; however, she went on `And how do you know that you're mad?'
  
  `To begin with,' said the Cat, `a dog's not mad. You grant that?'
  
  `I suppose so,' said Alice.
  
  `Well, then,' the Cat went on, `you see, a dog growls when it's angry, and wags its tail when it's pleased.
  Now I growl when I'm pleased, and wag my tail when I'm angry. Therefore I'm mad.'"
  
  

[bystander]

See what I mean! And besides you don't spell Alice with an A, it's Owlice.

[owlice]

<<From Homer onward, Athena's most common epithet is glaukopis (γλαυκώπις), which usually is translated as, bright-eyed or with gleaming eyes. The word is a combination of glaukos (γλαύκος, meaning gleaming, silvery, and later, bluish-green or gray) and ops (ώψ, eye, or sometimes, face).

It is interesting to note that glaux (γλαύξ, "owl") is from the same root, presumably because of the bird's own distinctive eyes. The bird which sees well in the night is closely associated with the goddess of wisdom: in archaic images, Athena is frequently depicted with an owl perched on her head. Unsurprisingly, the owl became a sort of Athenian mascot.

In a temple at Phrixa in Elis Athena was known as Cydonia.>>

Not just "sort of." The owl is closely associated with Athena. But you know that already!

(glaukopis... must be the root for glaucoma, too, hmm?)

See what I mean! And besides you don't spell Alice with an A, it's Owlice.

Indeed, and there's a Chessie cat around here, too, I'm just sure of it! I see its smile sometimes.

[neufer]

<<From Homer onward, Athena's most common epithet is glaukopis (γλαυκώπις), which usually is translated as, bright-eyed or with gleaming eyes. The word is a combination of glaukos (γλαύκος, meaning gleaming, silvery, and later, bluish-green or gray) and ops (ώψ, eye, or sometimes, face). It is interesting to note that glaux (γλαύξ, "owl") is from the same root, presumably because of the bird's own distinctive eyes. The bird which sees well in the night is closely associated with the goddess of wisdom: in archaic images, Athena is frequently depicted with an owl perched on her head. Unsurprisingly, the owl became a sort of Athenian mascot.>>

Not just "sort of." The owl is closely associated with Athena. But you know that already!

"The Mascot" is closely associated with Bettina (my mother's name). But you know that already!

<<La mascotte ("The Mascot") is an operetta by Edmond Audran. The title (in English) initiated the use of the word 'mascot' in the English language to mean an animal, human, or thing which brought luck.

The story, set in the 17th century, is that of a farm girl who brought good luck to whoever possessed her, so long as she remained a virgin. The title was French slang derived from the Provençal term masco, meaning witch.

The best-known number of its tuneful score is the Act 1 duet for Bettina (the 'mascot' of the title) and Pippo, in which she tells him, with appropriate farmyard noises, that she loves him just as much as her beloved turkeys.>>

[owlice]

"The Mascot" is closely associated with Bettina (my mother's name). But you know that already!

The best-known number of its tuneful score is the Act 1 duet for Bettina (the 'mascot' of the title) and Pippo, in which she tells him, with appropriate farmyard noises, that she loves him just as much as her beloved turkeys.>>

Oooooh, there's a line in there to be teased out that might very well sum up certain aspects of my life... but I'd best leave it lie!



Isn't that the most stupid-looking owl EVER? What an embarrassment to Strigiformes everywhere!

[wonderboy]

I dunno, I just spoke to an owl who said he WISHED he had a hat like that.

He also wants to know what he's taking to get his eyes like that... Something to do with better night vision or something i dunno, I've just recently learned the Hoot language.


Paul.

[Alex]

I’ve examined the celebrated Cydonian ‘face’ repeatedly and haven’t found any evidence of Neufer, Owlice, or Owls in it. I’ve also examined NASA photos of Cydonia for evidence of pyramids, monuments, and cities, as suggested by Myers, Hoagland and others. Had there been such structures on Mars, they may have been obliterated or covered up by a major catastrophe. Myers and Hoagland insist on a NASA-Government cover-up. Let’s allow NASA a ‘pass’ on this point. Obliteration of indisputable evidence of engineered structures on Mars can be ascribed to global disturbances brought about by a close encounter between Mars and, say, a passing comet.

Let’s consider the scenario imagined and vehemently defended by Immanuel Velikovsy: He proposed that around the 15th century BCE, a comet or comet-like object (now called the planet Venus), having originally been ejected from Jupiter, passed near Earth. The object changed Earth's orbit and axis, causing innumerable catastrophes and climate changes which were mentioned in early mythologies and religions around the world. Also mentioned in those mythologies are prior encounters between Mars and Venus. Those encounters were described as ‘wars’ between the two planets involving immense bolts of lightning. Had there been a civilization on Mars, at sites like Cydonia, they would undoubtedly have suffered extinction or decimation. My wild guess is that those unfortunate victims were drawn up and encapsulated in ball lightning globules. Then, many of these globules were deposited on Earth in places like Central America, Egypt and India. In the meantime Mars was stripped of its life-supporting atmosphere and vegetation and made desolate, as we see it today.

Given the nature of the structures at the Cydonia, as described by Myers and Hoagland, I conclude that the Martian civilization that thrived there may be characterized as ‘pre-Columbian’, that is, their structures are similar to those of the Aztecs, Mayans, and Incas. Now, let’s boldly assume that those unwilling Martian astronauts (or their DNA and genes) were deposited in the midst of primitive tribes living in the jungles of Yucatan or on the shores of the Nile. Would it be so surprising that, after about one generation, those people would build the pyramids and produce the arts and crafts that we find so fascinating? The only tangible thing I can offer to support this wild speculation is the famous ‘face’ over which I superimpose typical Mayan art. Please note the matching broad noses of the Cydonians and Mayans. The Cydonians probably needed huge nostrils because of the rareness of the Martian atmosphere, even before the global catastrophe.

[bystander]

Alex

I can only hope you have posted the above speculations for our amusement. Even so, I must say that this has passed far outside the realm of main steam science and the scope of this forum. If you seriously wish to discuss your proposals and conclusions, I suggest you take it to a forum where Myers, Hoagland, Vilikovsky, von Daniken, et al are considered worthy of discussion.

This topic is locked.

Reopened at OP's request pending further posts.

[Alex]

I admit that my last post went ‘over the top’ but it was specifically designed to debunk the Cydonia ‘face’ farce. In my initial post I paraphrased Gertrude Stein’s phrase ‘a rose is a rose is a rose is a rose’ by noting ‘a face is a face is a face. In that and subsequent posts I showed that by using a poorly-resolved Cydonia image, I could match some features of virtually any face at hand.

Although Rob did not agree, I thought I did pretty well with the Shroud of Turin. Then, Art offered me Alfred E. Neuman whose face posed a challenge that I could not resist. In my last post, after a search for Aztec, Mayan and Inca masks, I found a Mayan plaque that provided three faces to chose from. I use the face that best suited my match-up technique. I decided to invent a story to justify the ‘Mayan-Cydonian Mask’ overlay.

Although Velokovsky’s Jupiter-Venus-Earth-Mars scenario has been totally discredited, it provided a convenient way to explain why there is absolutely no evidence of engineered structures on Mars. In order to transport Martian ‘survivors’ to Earth, I encased them in fantastic globules of ball lightning - hinting at panspermia (the concept that life on Earth was ‘seeded’ from outer space).

I trust and sense that, thus far, those who posted responsive comments were amused by my attempts to ‘face down the face’. Of course, I’ve examined the best NASA images of Cydonia and am certain they show only natural terrain and outcroppings. In fact, for my Turin, Neuman and Mayan overlays, I avoided the most recent high-resolution images of the ‘face’ because they are simply ‘unaccommodating’.

[Beyond]

Finally!!!! I get to see a decent image of the "Mars Face".
After perusing both the informative and the non-informative information in all these posts, i have arrived at a conclusion, or two, or a few.
First -- the image is shown upside-down.
Second -- There is a certain symmetry to the image that would seem to set it apart from just random chance.
Third -- There is some serious damage to it most likely caused by a meteor or two. I would think that impacts that devastating would also cause some subtle shifts of alterations to take place and thus make it almost impossible to speculate further without someone actually being there and able to look inside the damaged part and do a walk around.

As for the Shroud of Turin -- Yes, it is old. Is it what a lot of people think it is? From what i know about things--its just as real as Noah's Ark, which they have found in the mountains of Turkey in at least two pieces - so far.

As for scientists and their testing of the shroud -- so far a lot of their tests have been thrown off due to bad choices of where and how to test the shroud due to an overabundence of caution of preserving everything possible.
From what i understand, they are planning very well the type of tests that they can now do due to advancements in technology and when its all set and the shroud is available again, there should be some very accurate results.

Of course we could just ask MR. Green but so far he just does not seem to want to comment on anything. Maybe he's the smartest one of all?