Speed of light

[aristarchusinexile]

G'day from the land of ozzz

The plot thickens, its not as simple as it looks.

How about some downhome plasma tornados Harry? http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1 ... roras.html

[aristarchusinexile]

Unfortnately the purpose of moderated fora is not that people like you might better understand anything but that people like you buy books ...

Public libaries are great places.
Moderators do sometimes get too fussy, but just think what we would have without them. (No status with 'higher uppers'.)

[aristarchusinexile]

Einstien was just a man, not a god. I'm wondering, with all that is known, and with the resources available, how much different Einstien's theories would be today.

Einstien, like many famous scientists, got credit for many other peoples' work; and Einstien admitted that he was far from finished his own work. He was never satisfied with his theories, and often greatly surprised and sometimes unhappy with other people's solutions to his theories .. black holes, for instance. The man that continues to amaze me is Pascual Jordan .. 'way back' then, seeing that everything came from nothing .. this is the foundation physics and cosmology rest on .. and echoed in MOG.

[BMAONE23]

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg2 ... verse.html

thought you guys may like to read this.

mark

interesting read...If we could channel that 100,000 amps and make use of it, it could be a good potential Free Energy source.

[The Code]

Its probably got something to do with thunder storms, the reason why they see plasma jets in space when a thunder storm discharges. I have for a long time thought the solar wind has got something to do with them...

Mark

[aristarchusinexile]

How is this relevant to the BB? The thread is about, Before the bb mate....trying to understand something from nothing.

Aside from the fact that the idea of "before" the BB is probably meaningless, because there was no time, that doesn't change the fact that nothing was "squeezed" at t=0. So your question about energy makes no sense to me.

I've seen a few references, Chris, in the past month to 'the time before the Big Bang' and not in National Enquirer, either.

[aristarchusinexile]

What do you know of Plasma Cosmology?

I know it is baloney. More to the point, and the reason for my warning, is that discussing it in this forum will get a topic locked, and has gotten posters banned.

You could tell Harry in a private message, Chris, why you think it's baloney.

[aristarchusinexile]

G'day Aris

The beaches in Australia are some of the greatest beaches in the world.

The Beaches vary from every type of sand, pebbles, boulders, shells, you name it.

Up North, they do become a bit dangerous with jelly fish and crocidiles.


================================

Please explain further non local attraction.

Local attraction of course is gravity. Non-local attraction would, for example, be a seeming 'drift' of two obects towards each other, the drift accountable for by no known means, chalked up easily as co-incidence until proven otherwise. If the Pioneers were one ship, the curiosity would be minimal .. but with two, doing the same thing, it's peculiar. With the Pioneeers, the sun has been ruled out by direction as a means of slowing the craft's outward progress, and the earth was said to be out of consideration because its gravity is too weak, so I don't know if it was considered otherwise. If I were capable I would plot the change in relationship to the earth. Of course, to say how non-local attraction works is impossible at this time, probably forever, but I "believe" the connection is between earth and ships.

Sounds like the North of Aussie is similar to the North of Canada, except we have big bears and bugs in killing numbers, along with snowflakes and icebergs.

[Chris Peterson]

I've seen a few references, Chris, in the past month to 'the time before the Big Bang' and not in National Enquirer, either.

Yes, but you are talking about people discussing other theories, or more often, expanding on the BBT. Under the best developed theories, the idea of "before" the BB has little or no meaning. Part of the problem is what "before" means if there was no time. And some of the discussion you refer to does address just that, relating "before" to causality and not to time at all.

[The Code]

All depends on which singularity effects time? All the so called BH in the universe do not effect our time, just the local. Understanding how the BB came about would be the clincher. Something from nothing.. If there is an outside to our prison, with the dark flow... means, ''its'' time was not effected by our Big Bang either. I can not comprehend ''from nothing'' that our universe is expanding, or has finished expanding into? cos what they are saying is, it is not just something from nothing (BB). Its also expanding into nothing as we speak..

mark

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzzzz

Aris you may find this paper of interest. Just off the press.

http://arxiv.org/abs/0904.3973
Gravitational and Cosmological Spectral Shift with Remote Quantum States

Authors: Charles Francis
(Submitted on 25 Apr 2009)

Abstract: A class of coordinate systems is found for Friedmann Cosmologies with local gravity such that it is possible to formulate quantum theory over astronomical and cosmological distances. When light from distance objects is treated as a quantum motion, new predictions are found for cosmological redshift and lensing. Good agreement is found between predictions and supernova redshifts for a closed Friedmann Cosmology with no cosmological constant and expanding at half the rate of the standard model. A previously unmodelled component of cosmological redshift accounts for the anomalous Pioneer blueshift, and for the flattening of galaxy rotation curves simulating a MONDian law. Distant lenses have a quarter of the mass required by standard general relativity. Missing mass can be accounted by a massive neutrino. CDM is not required.

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzz


Did you know that the word baloney was coined in the land of ozzzzzz.


Smile

[bystander]

Did you know that the word baloney was coined in the land of ozzzzzz.

au contraire

ba lo ney   /bəˈloʊni/ [buh-loh-nee]

–noun

1. Slang. foolishness; nonsense.
2. Informal. bologna.

–interjection

3. Slang. nonsense.

Also, boloney.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Origin:
1915–20, Americanism; 1925–30 for def. 2; alter. of bologna, with substitution of -ey for final schwa

Bologna sausage (pronounced /boˈloʊni/) is an American sausage somewhat similar to the Italian mortadella (a finely hashed/ground pork sausage containing cubes of lard that originated in the Italian city of Bologna). US Government regulations require American bologna to be finely ground, and it does not contain visible pieces of fat. Bologna can alternatively be made out of chicken, turkey, beef, or pork. It is commonly called bologna and often pronounced and/or spelled baloney. The origin of the name also comes from the origin of mortadella, which is native to Bologna.

Not to be confused with devon.

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzzz

Can you believe it mate that the USA wants to get credit for the Baloney.

I don't believe it I thought all this time that the land of ozzzz was the one an only baloney origin.

======================

As for this topic, I keep on reading papers and this one just like the others is quite interesting.

http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0605088

The Turbulent Interstellar Medium

Authors: Andreas Burkert (University of Munich)
(Submitted on 3 May 2006)

Abstract: An overview is presented of the main properties of the interstellar medium. Evidence is summarized that the interstellar medium is highly turbulent, driven on different length scales by various energetic processes. Large-scale turbulence determines the formation of structures like filaments and shells in the diffuse interstellar medium. It also regulates the formation of dense, cold molecular clouds. Molecular clouds are now believed to be transient objects that form on timescales of order 1e7 yrs in regions where HI gas is compressed and cools. Supersonic turbulence in the compressed HI slab is generated by a combination of hydrodynamical instabilities, coupled with cooling. Turbulent dissipation is compensated by the kinetic energy input of the inflow. Molecular hydrogen eventually forms when the surface density in the slab reaches a threshold value of 1e21 cm^-2 at which point further cooling triggers the onset of star formation by gravitational collapse. A few Myrs later, the newly formed stars and resulting supernovae will disperse their molecular surrounding and generate new expanding shells that drive again turbulence in the diffuse gas and trigger the formation of a next generation of cold clouds. Although a consistent scenario of interstellar medium dynamics and star formation is emerging many details are still unclear and require more detailed work on microphysical processes as well as a better understanding of supersonic, compressible turbulence.

[harry]

G'day from the land of oz


Mark Swain posted

Giant space tornadoes create Earth's auroras
http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg2 ... verse.html

Good journal writing that has little meaning.

============================================

How can there be no before if there was a before?
You cannot create something from nothing.


Some may find this paper interesting:

http://arxiv.org/abs/0712.4180
Quantum Resolution of Cosmological Singularities using AdS/CFT

Authors: Ben Craps, Thomas Hertog, Neil Turok
(Submitted on 27 Dec 2007 (v1), last revised 9 Apr 2008 (this version, v4))

Abstract: The AdS/CFT correspondence allows us to map a dynamical cosmology to a dual quantum field theory living on the boundary of spacetime. Specifically, we study a five-dimensional model cosmology in type IIB supergravity, where the dual theory is an unstable deformation of $\N=4$ supersymmetric SU(N) gauge theory on $\Rbar\times S^3$. A one-loop computation shows that the coupling governing the instability is asymptotically free, so quantum corrections cannot turn the potential around. The big crunch singularity in the bulk occurs when a boundary scalar field runs to infinity, in finite time. Consistent quantum evolution requires that we impose boundary conditions at infinite scalar field, {\it i.e.} a self-adjoint extension of the system. We find that quantum spreading of the homogeneous mode of the boundary scalar leads to a natural UV cutoff in particle production as the wavefunction for the homogeneous mode bounces back from infinity. Translating back to the bulk theory, we find that a quantum transition from a big crunch to a big bang is the most probable outcome of cosmological evolution, for a specific parameter range. Intriguingly, the instability and approximate scale-invariance of the boundary theory lead to the generation of an approximately scale-invariant spectrum of stress-energy perturbations on the boundary, whose amplitude is naturally small. We comment on qualitative differences with holographic descriptions of large black holes, on four-dimensional generalizations and on implications for cosmological perturbations.

Imagiantion can play tricks on time.

We can think in the past, we can think NOW and we can think in the future, but! we cannot make time a reality by thinking.

[aristarchusinexile]

I've seen a few references, Chris, in the past month to 'the time before the Big Bang' and not in National Enquirer, either.

Yes, but you are talking about people discussing other theories, or more often, expanding on the BBT. Under the best developed theories, the idea of "before" the BB has little or no meaning. Part of the problem is what "before" means if there was no time. And some of the discussion you refer to does address just that, relating "before" to causality and not to time at all.

But some also refer to the "time" before the bang .. and people are also talking about bang being a wrong theory. So .. discussion goes on.

[aristarchusinexile]

As for this topic, I keep on reading papers and this one just like the others is quite interesting.

http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0605088

The Turbulent Interstellar Medium

Authors: Andreas Burkert (University of Munich)
(Submitted on 3 May 2006)

Abstract: An overview is presented of the main properties of the interstellar medium. Evidence is summarized that the interstellar medium is highly turbulent, driven on different length scales by various energetic processes. Large-scale turbulence determines the formation of structures like filaments and shells in the diffuse interstellar medium. It also regulates the formation of dense, cold molecular clouds. Molecular clouds are now believed to be transient objects that form on timescales of order 1e7 yrs in regions where HI gas is compressed and cools. Supersonic turbulence in the compressed HI slab is generated by a combination of hydrodynamical instabilities, coupled with cooling. Turbulent dissipation is compensated by the kinetic energy input of the inflow. Molecular hydrogen eventually forms when the surface density in the slab reaches a threshold value of 1e21 cm^-2 at which point further cooling triggers the onset of star formation by gravitational collapse. A few Myrs later, the newly formed stars and resulting supernovae will disperse their molecular surrounding and generate new expanding shells that drive again turbulence in the diffuse gas and trigger the formation of a next generation of cold clouds. Although a consistent scenario of interstellar medium dynamics and star formation is emerging many details are still unclear and require more detailed work on microphysical processes as well as a better understanding of supersonic, compressible turbulence.

Good stuff which my view reflects, many thanks Harry. I see by the Wiki definition 'turbulence' does not necessarily mean 'rough' although 'rough' is a generalized indication ('rough' and 'smooth' being relative). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbulence "In fluid dynamics, turbulence or turbulent flow is a fluid regime characterized by chaotic, stochastic property changes. This includes low momentum diffusion, high momentum convection, and rapid variation of pressure and velocity in space and time. Flow that is not turbulent is called laminar flow."

These flows are the riverlike currents, indicated by slight temperature differences, possibly in the theoretical Dark Matter (or Dark Energy) I urged Nereid to search for many weeks ago. Galaxies, in my view, are merely eddies on the edge of flows. The whirl of spirals is driven from the edge, compressing the centre, creating whatever is found at the centre, Jets result as necessary release of pressure .. my view differing from the Black Hole driven spiral as the common view seems to hold. As I have said many times, 'view carefully the surface of a river and hehold the universe'. My view also accounts for why Spirals' arms are rotating faster than they would if driven by the centre .. no Dark Matter needed, MOG not needed.

[harry]

G'day Aris

Seems you like to read and it seems that your interested in cosmology.

Papers written by N Turock are interesting reading. He is no monkey and has written some papers with various scientists including S Hawkings.

Neil Turok
http://arxiv.org/find/hep-th/1/au:+Turo ... /0/all/0/1

This does not mean that I agree with what he says, but he does present some interesting models backed by science.

[aristarchusinexile]

G'day Aris

Seems you like to read and it seems that your interested in cosmology.

Papers written by N Turock are interesting reading. He is no monkey and has written some papers with various scientists including S Hawkings.

Neil Turok
http://arxiv.org/find/hep-th/1/au:+Turo ... /0/all/0/1

This does not mean that I agree with what he says, but he does present some interesting models backed by science.

Turock is Director of Perimetre Research Institute in Waterloo, Canada, to which Hawking just went. I read one of his books. Papers, except for faint gleanings, are mostly beyond me. It may have been in Turock's book I read of the miles-large time machine which is said to be totally doable given the technology and power source. My reading is slowing down considerably as I'm focusing on preparations for several (hopefully, many) weeks canoing this spring, summer, autumn. Destination, French River, Ontario .. then perhaps a paddle of about 1,000 miles from the French to Ottawa through the coloured leaves of autumn. If God permits.

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzz

You lucky duck. Canoing in those places, its a dream.

When I was younger I did a bit of surf canoing and nearly killed myself with a 5m wave.

Aris stay cool and smell the roses, cosmology will be here in one form or another.

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzz

I think I posted this paper before.

http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0702153
Generating Ekpyrotic Curvature Perturbations Before the Big Bang

Authors: Jean-Luc Lehners, Paul McFadden, Neil Turok, Paul J. Steinhardt
(Submitted on 19 Feb 2007)

Abstract: We analyze a general mechanism for producing a nearly scale-invariant spectrum of cosmological curvature perturbations during a contracting phase preceding a big bang, that can be entirely described using 4d effective field theory. The mechanism, based on first producing entropic perturbations and then converting them to curvature perturbations, can be naturally incorporated in cyclic and ekpyrotic models in which the big bang is modelled as a brane collision, as well as other types of cosmological models with a pre-big bang phase. We show that the correct perturbation amplitude can be obtained and that the scalar spectral tilt n tends to range from slightly blue to red, with 0.97 < n < 1.02 for the simplest models, a range compatible with current observations but shifted by a few per cent towards the blue compared to the prediction of the simplest, large-field inflationary models.

[aristarchusinexile]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzz

I think I posted this paper before.

http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0702153
Generating Ekpyrotic Curvature Perturbations Before the Big Bang

Authors: Jean-Luc Lehners, Paul McFadden, Neil Turok, Paul J. Steinhardt
(Submitted on 19 Feb 2007)

Abstract: We analyze a general mechanism for producing a nearly scale-invariant spectrum of cosmological curvature perturbations during a contracting phase preceding a big bang, that can be entirely described using 4d effective field theory. The mechanism, based on first producing entropic perturbations and then converting them to curvature perturbations, can be naturally incorporated in cyclic and ekpyrotic models in which the big bang is modelled as a brane collision, as well as other types of cosmological models with a pre-big bang phase. We show that the correct perturbation amplitude can be obtained and that the scalar spectral tilt n tends to range from slightly blue to red, with 0.97 < n < 1.02 for the simplest models, a range compatible with current observations but shifted by a few per cent towards the blue compared to the prediction of the simplest, large-field inflationary models.

And where would any of this be without Faraday's fields, and Faraday couldn't do Calculus.

[aristarchusinexile]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzz

You lucky duck. Canoing in those places, its a dream.

When I was younger I did a bit of surf canoing and nearly killed myself with a 5m wave.

Aris stay cool and smell the roses, cosmology will be here in one form or another.

Thanks Harry. I needed the 'stay cool and smell the roses'. I'm glad you survived the wave.

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzzz

I survived the wave, but got caught in a ripp that pulled me out.

Life savers were loking for me, but I was lucky the current dropped me onshore away from the location.

You got to be lucky sometimes.

==================================================

Came across this paper

http://arxiv.org/abs/0904.1334
Horava-Lifshitz Cosmology

Authors: Elias Kiritsis (U. of Crete), Georgios Kofinas (U. of Crete)
(Submitted on 8 Apr 2009 (v1), last revised 27 Apr 2009 (this version, v3))

Abstract: The cosmological equations suggested by the non-relativistic renormalizable gravitational theory proposed by Ho\v{r}ava are considered. It is pointed out that the early universe cosmology has features that may give an alternative to inflation and the theory may be able to escape singularities.

[harry]

G'day from the land of ozzzzzzzzz

Is the Universe rotating?

We know that the solar sytem rotates, the galaxy rotates, the local group of galaxies rotate and so on. As it grows to super dooper galaxies do they rotate as a total unit the bigger they get?

This link is interesting.

http://arxiv.org/abs/0902.4575
Is the universe rotating?

Authors: Shi-Chun Su, M.-C. Chu
(Submitted on 26 Feb 2009 (v1), last revised 25 Mar 2009 (this version, v2))

Abstract: Models of a rotating universe have been studied widely since G{\"o}del \cite{1}, who showed an example that is consistent with General Relativity (GR). By now, the possibility of a rotating universe has been discussed comprehensively in the framework of some types of Bianchi's models, such as Type V, VII and IX \cite{2,3}. Recent discoveries of some non-Gaussian properties of the Cosmic Microwave Background Anisotropies (CMBA) \cite{nG1,nG2,nG3,nG4,nG5,nG6,nG7}, such as the suppression of the quadrupole and the alignment of some multipoles draw our attention to some Bianchi models with rotation \cite{bi1,bi2}. However, cosmological data, such as those of the CMBA, strongly prefer a homogeneous and isotropic model. Therefore, it is of interest to discuss the rotation of the universe as a perturbation of the Robertson-Walker metric, to constrain the rotating speed by cosmological data and to discuss whether it could be the origin of the non-Gaussian properties of the CMBA mentioned above. Here, we derive the general form of the metric (up to 2nd-order perturbations) which is compatible with the rotation perturbation in a $\Lambda$-CDM universe. By comparing the 2nd-order Sachs-Wolfe effect \cite{4,5,6,7,8} due to rotation with the CMBA data, we can then constrain the angular speed of the rotation to be less than $10^{-9}$ rad yr$^{-1}$ at the last scattering surface.