Search found 13 matches

by green1
Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:20 am
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

I am surprised. If this is simply a sunrise viewed through insulated glass, it should be a commonly viewed phenomenon, given the proliferation of insulated windows in our world. Since this discussion started there have been many sunrises and sunsets, yet not one (natural) photo showing this kind of ...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 8:55 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

This experiment also reveals the smearing/ghosting from internal reflections within the individual panes of glass- something that is equally evident in the APOD images. Chris, your experiment shows exactly what i was trying to prove yesterday. The overlapping ghost images are brighter where they ov...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 6:52 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

[quote="Chris Peterson: Although it is pretty obvious that this isn't an atmospheric phenomenon, it is quite certain that it can't be a refractive one at all."] Chris, you are forgetting that ALL the images in the photo are refracted images. The primary image is refracted (yes, dissipated)...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 6:31 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

I will post one more illustration to show how colder polar air could refract the light to give the result of multiple sun images. Remember this is viewed through the cold air "lens" at an oblique angle that will increase the effect. The red dot is the True North Pole, the white disk repres...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 4:03 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

Naos, I'm trying to make sense of your computer simulations. Where is the light source? You are showing (in figure one) converging rays which seem to bounce around almost endlessly inside the glass pane then diverge again when exiting the glass? In figure two the rays are diverging into the glass an...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 2:25 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

[quote="Naos"] "why do you use a point source at finite distance to represent the sun in your last drawings ? it seems quite strange to me. I would have used a set of collimated beams coming from a direction" Naos, the rays are representational only, not intended to be to scale. ...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:06 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

In the example of reflected light we see the same scenario. For the images to show up on the left of the primary the window must be at right angles to the (apparent) face of the building. REFL1.jpg [Hi green1, you still missed a vital part of the circumstances, and that's to have two panes of glass ...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:01 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

Let’s illustrate various window configurations that might result in ghost images due to refraction. With the window perpendicular to the lens, there would be images on both sides. RAYS1.jpg With the window at the same angle as the balcony rail (most likely) any images would be to the right. RAYS2.jp...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:39 am
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

In the next image, I illustrate the the parabola that would be required to bring any reflected images to a single image. (This is assuming that the balcony railing is perpendicular to the window, which I think is reasonable.) The sun would have to move to the point on the right of the photo to be at...
by green1
Wed Aug 05, 2009 12:37 am
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

series.JPG just for fun I decided to cut and past a series of these photos to see what transpired as the sun rises. I still don't see any reflections that would be caused by window glass. As the sun rises, the reflections merge, and the angle of attack increases from about 90 degrees to close to 50...
by green1
Tue Aug 04, 2009 7:45 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

IMG reflect.JPG I just decided to attempt to see what a reflected image would look like by first erasing the two reflected images, then copy and pasting them and increasing the transparency of the copies. You will see that the copies are still identical with the original. Even the reflected glow on...
by green1
Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:41 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

["It was rising above Lake Superior through the window behind me. I was surprised to see two suns, one on top of the other... I went across to the cafe’s terrace entrance and pushed the door open ... Sure enough, with nothing but our atmosphere between me and Sol, the image remained the same. I...
by green1
Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:21 pm
Forum: The Bridge: Discuss an Astronomy Picture of the Day
Topic: APOD: A Triple Sunrise Over Gdansk Bay (2009 Aug 04)
Replies: 338
Views: 56226

Re: Cause of Triple Sunrise (APOD 2009 August 4)

My inclination is to believe that the primary reflection is from a reflective surface, the faintest is from either the glass lens or window pane (also why it wasn't visible to the naked eye.) Note that the 2 reflections are the same in outline but vary in saturation, and both are different than the ...