Starship Asterisk*

I believe M32 is actually slightly brighter. Also, as far as galaxies go, size is an enemy.
The larger they are, the more diffuse the light, and as such, the dimmer.

[url=http://www.cfht.hawaii.edu/HawaiianStarlight/]Hawaiian Starlight: Canada France Hawaii Telescope - Astronomy Image of the Month[/url]

Great Site!

If M110 is bigger and brighter than M32, as it appears to be in photos that capture both, why is it not one of the original Messier objects?

M32: [url=http://www.cfht.hawaii.edu/HawaiianStarlight/AIOM/English/CFHT-Coelum-AIOM-Feb2008.html]CFHT AIOM - February, 2008[/url]
M110: [url=http://www.cfht.hawaii.edu/HawaiianStarlight/AIOM/English/CFHT-Coelum-AIOM-Sep2008.html]CFHT AIOM - September, 2008[/url]

[quote="KerryE"]In the picture there appears to me to be a dark grey circular or oblong object at 9:30 from centre, half way to the edge (when viewed in landscape orientation), that is not part of the galaxy.
Does anyone else see it, and if so, any idea what it might be:?:[/quote]

I think I see it; Kind of looks black with a white dot; almost metalic; a little below and to the left of the large star at 10 o'clock. I have not a clue.

Orin

Thanks Art; Hrundi: Real nice explanation. 8)
Orin

Basically the Maffei 1 group is another group of galaxies, very close to the local group, and could once have been a member of the local group but isn't anymore.
Dwingeloo 1 is most probably a member of that Maffei 1 group, and not the local group.

[quote="orin stepanek"]So; does Dwingeloo belong to the local group or Maffei group? Or is the Maffei group also a part of the local group?:? :?:
Orin[/quote]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_Group

<<Edwin Hubble was the first to identify the Local Group in Chapter VI of his book The Realm of Nebulae (Hubble 1936, pp. 124–151). There he describes it as "a typical small group of nebulae which is isolated in the general field." In that book, he delineated by decreasing luminosity its members to be M31, the Milky Way, M33, the Large Magellanic Cloud, the Small Magellanic Cloud, M32, NGC 205, NGC 6822, NGC 185, IC 1613 and NGC 147. He also identified IC 10 as a possible Local Group member. In the ~70 years since his work, the number of known Local Group members has increased from his initial twelve to thirty-six as of 2003, by way of the discovery of almost two dozen low-luminosity galaxies.

The Local Group...comprises over 35 galaxies, with its gravitational center located somewhere between the Milky Way and the Andromeda Galaxy. The galaxies of the Local Group cover a 10 million light-year diameter and have a binary (dumbbell) shape. The group itself is one of many within the Virgo Supercluster (i.e. the Local Supercluster).

The two most massive members of the group are the Milky Way and the Andromeda Galaxy. These two barred spirals each have a system of satellite galaxies.

* The Milky Way's satellite system consists of Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy, Large Magellanic Cloud, Small Magellanic Cloud, Canis Major Dwarf, Ursa Minor Dwarf, Draco Dwarf, Carina Dwarf, Sextans Dwarf, Sculptor Dwarf, Fornax Dwarf, Leo I, Leo II, and Ursa Major Dwarf.

* Andromeda's satellite system comprises M32, M110, NGC 147, NGC 185, And I, And II, And III, And IV, And V, Pegasus dSph, Cassiopeia Dwarf, And VIII, And IX, and And X.

* The Triangulum Galaxy, the third largest and only ordinary spiral galaxy in the Local Group, may or may not be a companion to the Andromeda galaxy but probably has Pisces Dwarf as a satellite.

The other members of the group are gravitationally secluded from these large subgroups: IC1613, Phoenix Dwarf, Leo A, Tucana Dwarf, Cetus Dwarf, Pegasus Dwarf Irregular, Wolf-Lundmark-Melotte, Aquarius Dwarf, and Sagittarius Dwarf Irregular.>>
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mafia

<<The Mafia is a Sicilian criminal secret society which is believed to have first developed in the mid-19th century in Sicily. The Sicilian Cosa Nostra is a loose confederation of about one hundred Mafia groups, also called cosche or families, each of which claims sovereignty over a territory, usually a town or village or a neighborhood of a larger city, though without ever fully conquering and legitimizing its monopoly of violence.
.
Michael Corleone: "Fredo, you're my older brother, and I love you. But don't ever take sides with anyone against the Family again. Ever. "
.
According to historian Paolo Pezzino: "The Mafia is a kind of organized crime being active not only in several illegal fields, but also tending to exercise sovereignty functions – normally belonging to public authorities – over a specific territory...">>
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paolo_Maffei

<<Paolo Maffei (born 1926) is an Italian astronomer and science writer. He was born in Foligno and he has been former director of the Catania Observatory and an astronomer at Arcetri, Bologna, Asiago and Hamburg. He studied comets, variable stars, galaxies and the evolution of the universe. Maffei is well known as a writer of history of astronomy and popularizer of astronomy through a serious books, including the Al di là della Luna (1973) and I mostri del cielo (1976).>>
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maffei_1

<<Maffei 1 is the closest giant elliptical galaxy to the Milky Way. Once believed to be a member of the Local Group, it is now known to be a member of the IC 342/Maffei Group. It was discovered with the neighbouring Maffei 2 by Paolo Maffei in 1968 from their infrared emissions. Maffei 1 lies in the zone of avoidance and is heavily obscured by the Milky Way's stars and dust. It had been previously been catalogued as an emission nebula or H II region. If it were not obscured, it would be one of the brightest and best known galaxies in the sky.>>

So; does Dwingeloo belong to the local group or Maffei group? Or is the Maffei group also a part of the local group?:? :?:
Orin

I see what appears to be a bluish core that has some spiral characteristics, a dark dust lane between 9 & 11 just outside this bluish region (also a small dust lane at 2), the main body of the galaxy extending about 3 times the distance of the core region with what could be a tidal trail angled about 45deg toward the center of Andromeda that extends another 3.5 times the core distance.

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap080909.html

In the picture there appears to me to be a dark grey circular or oblong object at 9:30 from centre, half way to the edge (when viewed in landscape orientation), that is not part of the galaxy.
Does anyone else see it, and if so, any idea what it might be:?:

[quote="henk21cm"][quote="Hrundi"]I noticed it said that Dwingeloo 1 is a member of the Local Group.
I thought it was a member of the Maffei 1 Group?[/quote]
Welcome Hrundi to the forum. You are right. The [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IC_342/Maffei_Group]wikipedia on Dwingeloo I[/url] reports that it is a member of the Maffei 1 subgroup. It is classified as SB, so a barred spiral, as [b]BMAONE23[/b] noticed.[/quote]
http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap080109.html
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<<The two Maffei galaxies were discovered by Paolo Maffei in 1968. He noticed an Infrared Object in the Region of IC 1895 and he suggested that there might be obscured galaxies in this region. The two galaxies had previously been catalogued as emission nebulae - Stewart Sharpless listed them as objects 191 and 197 in his Catalogue of H II Regions published in 1959.

Between 1971 and 1973, two groups lead by Hyron Spinrad confirmed that Maffei I and II were galaxies and they suggested that Maffei I might be a member of the Local Group. They were wrong, but it is not unusual to see reference books describe Maffei I as a Local Group galaxy.>>

http://www.atlasoftheuniverse.com/galgrps/maffei.html
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That DOG will hunt:
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<<The Dwingeloo galaxies were discovered in 1994 by the "Dwingeloo Obscured Galaxy Survey" (DOGS). They are named after the 25m radio telescope in the Netherlands that first detected it. It was first detected at radio wavelengths by radiation from the 21cm emission line of neutral atomic hydrogen in the course of a 'blind' survey of the plane of the northern Milky Way.>>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwingeloo_1

[quote="Hrundi"]I noticed it said that Dwingeloo 1 is a member of the Local Group.
I thought it was a member of the Maffei 1 Group?[/quote]

Welcome Hrundi to the forum. You are right. The [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IC_342/Maffei_Group]wikipedia on Dwingeloo I[/url] reports that it is a member of the Maffei 1 subgroup. It is classified as SB, so a barred spiral, as [b]BMAONE23[/b] noticed.

It is a nice barred spiral though

[quote="Hrundi"]I noticed it said that Dwingeloo 1 is a member of the Local Group.
I thought it was a member of the Maffei 1 Group?[/quote]

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap000109.html
It is hard to make out the spirals in Dwingeloo I as it is all but hidden by out own Milky way. No wonder it took so long to discover.

Orin

I noticed it said that Dwingeloo 1 is a member of the Local Group.
I thought it was a member of the Maffei 1 Group?

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap080909.html

Hans Kanitschar asked what galaxy is above M110. Hans it is the Andromeda Galaxy. M110 is a satellite of this galaxy. The Milky way is a neighbor of Andromeda. Someday all these galaxies will merge and become one; as they are drawing toward each other.
BTW welcome to the Asterisk Night Sky Live Forum.

Orin