by Nicholas » Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:55 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: ↑Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:25 pm
Nicholas wrote: ↑Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:09 am
It is a pet peeve of mine that this great photo is referred to as an Earthrise, which it is not. As scientists I am surprised NASA allowed it, as it gives the impression that there is an Earth rise to be seen from the moon, which there is not. Granted, "Earth Coming into View" is not as poetic as Earth Rise, but the odd circumstance of the geocentric position of Earth in the Moon's sky is poetically fascinating enough by itself not to loose the teaching moment of accuracy for the sake of a slick title for a poster. It would be like drawing a smiley face on the Earth so as to appeal to more people. And did I mention that it was a pet peeve of mine?
It doesn't seem like an inaccurate description to me. Indeed, as long as humans have been orbiting the Earth in spacecraft, they (and we) have spoken of their experiencing sunrises and sunsets about every 90 minutes. "Rise" and "set" reasonably describe the visual experience, not just the rotational dynamics.
I know, I know. I do it too. I say "look at the pretty sunrise" and "what time does the Sun go down?" It certainly looks like it does, which is why people assumed the Earth was the center of the Universe for so long. But (April-April?) we now mostly know it is not! I make a point of reminding myself that the Earth is rotating and bringing the Sun into and out of view, rather than rising and falling through the sky. I love the 3D feeling it gives to our orbit and rotation. This is a fantastic ride we're on and sometimes I get the sensation that I can 'FEEL' its motion. I don't mean to be picky and say our astronauts are in the Earths eclipse at night (which they are, right?) but to fly over the part of the moon that faces earth and call it Earthrise when it does not appear to rise or set unless your flying 1500 MPH is misleading about a very interesting and UNEARTHLY phenomenon.
MarkBour wrote: ↑Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:44 am
Nicholas wrote: ↑Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:09 am
It is a pet peeve of mine that this great photo is referred to as an Earthrise, which it is not. As scientists I am surprised NASA allowed it, as it gives the impression that there is an Earth rise to be seen from the moon, which there is not. Granted, "Earth Coming into View" is not as poetic as Earth Rise, but the odd circumstance of the geocentric position of Earth in the Moon's sky is poetically fascinating enough by itself not to loose the teaching moment of accuracy for the sake of a slick title for a poster. It would be like drawing a smiley face on the Earth so as to appeal to more people. And did I mention that it was a pet peeve of mine?
It looked like an Earthrise to me. ... Maybe I'm not a scientist.
As the video shows, the moon's surface is moving toward the camera as the earth appears to rise. It is that motion of the spacecraft traveling to the side of the moon that is facing earth that gives the impression of it 'rising'. If one were standing on the moon's surface there is not that daily rising and setting we assume it has. There is no "dark side of the moon", but there is that other side from which you would NEVER see the earth. (which we confer in the fact that we only ever see the one same side facing us) There is sunrise and sunset on the moon, but there are only 12 days in its year, (each about 28 earth days long) 14 earth days in daylight and 14 earth days of night each. And to be more accurate, there IS a slight rising and setting of Earth over the course of 28 earth days IF you are observing it from a point along the horizon that WE see as the outside edge of the moon, but its only a few degrees up and down, due to the fact the orbital plane of moon around earth is like 5 degrees different from earths orbital plane around the sun. But if you are standing other than at that 'horizon' the earth just wobbles back and forth a little up in the sky,( rotating completely around once every 24 hours of course), but not touching the horizon ever unless your standing near that edge of the back half of the moon that we never see. It never goes across the sky. For the Moon settlements to come, where that settlement is located will determine whether the Earth appears high in the sky, low on the horizon, or completely blocked from view
[quote="Chris Peterson" post_id=288334 time=1545661513 user_id=117706]
[quote=Nicholas post_id=288323 time=1545620956 user_id=144568]
It is a pet peeve of mine that this great photo is referred to as an Earthrise, which it is not. As scientists I am surprised NASA allowed it, as it gives the impression that there is an Earth rise to be seen from the moon, which there is not. Granted, "Earth Coming into View" is not as poetic as Earth Rise, but the odd circumstance of the geocentric position of Earth in the Moon's sky is poetically fascinating enough by itself not to loose the teaching moment of accuracy for the sake of a slick title for a poster. It would be like drawing a smiley face on the Earth so as to appeal to more people. And did I mention that it was a pet peeve of mine?
[/quote]
It doesn't seem like an inaccurate description to me. Indeed, as long as humans have been orbiting the Earth in spacecraft, they (and we) have spoken of their experiencing sunrises and sunsets about every 90 minutes. "Rise" and "set" reasonably describe the visual experience, not just the rotational dynamics.
I know, I know. I do it too. I say "look at the pretty sunrise" and "what time does the Sun go down?" It certainly looks like it does, which is why people assumed the Earth was the center of the Universe for so long. But (April-April?) we now mostly know it is not! I make a point of reminding myself that the Earth is rotating and bringing the Sun into and out of view, rather than rising and falling through the sky. I love the 3D feeling it gives to our orbit and rotation. This is a fantastic ride we're on and sometimes I get the sensation that I can 'FEEL' its motion. I don't mean to be picky and say our astronauts are in the Earths eclipse at night (which they are, right?) but to fly over the part of the moon that faces earth and call it Earthrise when it does not appear to rise or set unless your flying 1500 MPH is misleading about a very interesting and UNEARTHLY phenomenon.
[/quote][quote=MarkBour post_id=288326 time=1545637495 user_id=141361]
[quote=Nicholas post_id=288323 time=1545620956 user_id=144568]
It is a pet peeve of mine that this great photo is referred to as an Earthrise, which it is not. As scientists I am surprised NASA allowed it, as it gives the impression that there is an Earth rise to be seen from the moon, which there is not. Granted, "Earth Coming into View" is not as poetic as Earth Rise, but the odd circumstance of the geocentric position of Earth in the Moon's sky is poetically fascinating enough by itself not to loose the teaching moment of accuracy for the sake of a slick title for a poster. It would be like drawing a smiley face on the Earth so as to appeal to more people. And did I mention that it was a pet peeve of mine?
[/quote]
It looked like an Earthrise to me. ... Maybe I'm not a scientist.
As the video shows, the moon's surface is moving toward the camera as the earth appears to rise. It is that motion of the spacecraft traveling to the side of the moon that is facing earth that gives the impression of it 'rising'. If one were standing on the moon's surface there is not that daily rising and setting we assume it has. There is no "dark side of the moon", but there is that other side from which you would NEVER see the earth. (which we confer in the fact that we only ever see the one same side facing us) There is sunrise and sunset on the moon, but there are only 12 days in its year, (each about 28 earth days long) 14 earth days in daylight and 14 earth days of night each. And to be more accurate, there IS a slight rising and setting of Earth over the course of 28 earth days IF you are observing it from a point along the horizon that WE see as the outside edge of the moon, but its only a few degrees up and down, due to the fact the orbital plane of moon around earth is like 5 degrees different from earths orbital plane around the sun. But if you are standing other than at that 'horizon' the earth just wobbles back and forth a little up in the sky,( rotating completely around once every 24 hours of course), but not touching the horizon ever unless your standing near that edge of the back half of the moon that we never see. It never goes across the sky. For the Moon settlements to come, where that settlement is located will determine whether the Earth appears high in the sky, low on the horizon, or completely blocked from view
[quote][url]https://www.dictionary.com/browse/earthrise?s=t[/url]
earthrise [urth-rahyz]
noun Astronomy.
the rising of the earth above the horizon of the moon or other celestial body, viewed from that body's surface or from a spacecraft orbiting it.
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