APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

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Expand view Topic review: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Ann » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:16 pm

Nitpicker wrote:Can't believe I missed this entertaining discussion. Naturally, a lot of it is below the belt. :ssmile:

It must have been great to first discover the large, round nebula around Meissa, so that Orion no longer looked like a pin-head. But Barnard's Loop seems to indicate lumbar issues.
Ouch!

Can anyone draw the outline of the poor lumbar spine Hunter/Huntress?

Ann

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Nitpicker » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:12 am

Can't believe I missed this entertaining discussion. Naturally, a lot of it is below the belt. :ssmile:

It must have been great to first discover the large, round nebula around Meissa, so that Orion no longer looked like a pin-head. But Barnard's Loop seems to indicate lumbar issues.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by deathfleer » Tue Apr 25, 2017 10:30 pm

what we see is two dimensional

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Chris Peterson » Fri Dec 16, 2016 9:25 pm

rstevenson wrote:What, ya mean we're not average?!?
Just like the kids in Lake Wobegon.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by rstevenson » Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:27 pm

What, ya mean we're not average?!?

Rob

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Chris Peterson » Fri Dec 16, 2016 4:14 pm

rstevenson wrote:Someday a PHD candidate will mine the fertile fields of the Asterisk for their disertation on the social and sexual mores of the early 21st century.
Via a very non-representative societal cross section, I think!

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by rstevenson » Fri Dec 16, 2016 4:09 pm

Someday a PHD candidate will mine the fertile fields of the Asterisk for their disertation on the social and sexual mores of the early 21st century.

Rob

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Doug County » Fri Dec 16, 2016 3:10 pm

More specifically a cross dresser, clothed in the wrong clothes by a patriarchal society who didn't look close enough to realize their mistake!

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Cousin Ricky » Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:04 am

If the revelation that Orion has a dong was shocking, wait till people find out she's transgender!

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Doug County » Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:22 pm

Thanks, Art for helping flesh out the "Orion is a Huntress" theme with a little more background. Maybe Orion is Artemis in disguise?

Re: Orion turns out to be a Huntress, folks

by starsurfer » Sun Dec 11, 2016 12:55 pm

Ann wrote:
Doug County wrote:
Given the active minds of our ancestors, may I humbly suggest that as our telescopes and other imaging technologies have "lifted the loincloth" of our much vaunted Orion the Hunter, it surprises me that nobody has caught on that instead of a progenitor of fatherhood, a close look at the nebulosity has revealed a very fecund birthing zone, a placental paradise for hundreds of proto and natal stellar-planetary systems! Isn't it obvious that our famed Hunter has been a Huntress all along?
:D :thumb_up:

Ann
I'd also like to mention that Orion contains a few planetary nebulae, clouds of stardeath!! :D

I really like planetary nebulae!

Artemis symbol: a hunting dog (cocker?)

by neufer » Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:59 pm

Doug County wrote:
Given the active minds of our ancestors, may I humbly suggest that as our telescopes and other imaging technologies have "lifted the loincloth" of our much vaunted Orion the Hunter, it surprises me that nobody has caught on that instead of a progenitor of fatherhood, a close look at the nebulosity has revealed a very fecund birthing zone, a placental paradise for hundreds of proto and natal stellar-planetary systems! Isn't it obvious that our famed Hunter has been a Huntress all along?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis#Orion wrote:
<<Artemis (Ancient Greek: Ἄρτεμις) was one of the most widely venerated of the Ancient Greek deities. Her Roman equivalent is Diana. She was the Hellenic goddess of the hunt, wild animals, wilderness, childbirth, virginity and protector of young girls, bringing and relieving disease in women. Her symbols included the golden bow and arrow, the hunting dog, the stag, and the moon.

Orion was Artemis' hunting companion. In some versions, he is killed by Artemis, while in others he is killed by a scorpion sent by Gaia. In some versions, Orion tries to seduce Opis, one of Artemis' followers, and she kills him. In a version by Aratus, Orion takes hold of Artemis' robe and she kills him in self-defense.

In yet another version, Apollo sends the scorpion. According to Hyginus Artemis once loved Orion (in spite of the late source, this version appears to be a rare remnant of her as the pre-Olympian goddess, who took consorts, as Eos did), but was tricked into killing him by her brother Apollo, who was "protective" of his sister's maidenhood.

A minor (119 km) planet, 105 Artemis ; a lunar crater; the Artemis Chasma and the Artemis Corona have all been named for her.>>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artemis_Corona wrote: <<This spectacular Magellan image shows the near-circular trough of Artemis Chasma. Its circular shape and size (2100 km in diameter) make Artemis the largest corona identified to date on the surface of Venus. Artemis could encompass most of the U.S. from the Front Range of the Rockies (near Denver) to the West Coast and is approximately twice the diameter of the next-smaller corona Heng-O. Coronae are characterized by a ring of concentric features surrounding an interior which typically contains fractures of varying orientations and volcanic features ranging from individual flows and small (<20 kilometer) volcanoes up to large (>100 kilometers) shield volcanoes. Artemis contains complex systems of fractures, numerous flows and small volcanoes, and at least two impact craters, the larger of which is located in the lower left (southwest) quadrant of the feature. The ring of fractures that defines Artemis forms a steep trough with raised rims approximately 120 kilometers wide and with as much as 2.5 kilometers of relief from the rim crest to the bottom of the trough. Most coronae are thought to be related to upwelling of hot material from the interior of Venus in the form of plumes or diapirs, and Artemis may be an extensional trough related to such an upwelling event. Raised-rim troughs are most commonly found to be extensional features (those formed by forces which tend to pull apart the crust and lithosphere of a planet) but the unusual size and circularity of Artemis have led to the alternate suggestion that it may be a zone of intense compression and underthrusting, similar to oceanic subduction zones on Earth. Magellan scientists are currently examining this feature in detail to determine which, if either, of these hypotheses is correct.>>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brine_shrimp wrote: <<Artemia (a.k.a., brine shrimp) is the only genius genus in the family Artemiidae. Artemia has changed little externally since the Triassic period. The first historical record of the existence of Artemia dates back to the first half of the 10th century AD from Urmia Lake, Iran, by Iranian geographer as "aquatic dog". Artemia populations are found worldwide in inland saltwater lakes, but not in oceans. Artemia are able to avoid cohabiting with most types of predators, such as fish, by their ability to live in waters of very high salinity (up to 25%). The ability of the Artemia to produce dormant eggs, known as cysts, has led to extensive use of Artemia in aquaculture. The cysts may be stored for long periods and hatched on demand to provide a convenient form of live feed for larval fish and crustaceans. Breeds of Artemia are sold as novelty gifts under the marketing name Sea-Monkeys or Aqua Dragons.

On Apollo 16 and Apollo 17, the cysts traveled to the Moon and back. The cosmic ray passed through an egg would be detected on the photographic film in their container. Some eggs were kept on Earth as experimental controls to ensure a fair test. Also, as the take-off in a spacecraft involves a lot of shaking and acceleration, one control group of egg cysts was accelerated to seven times the force of gravity and vibrated mechanically from side to side for several minutes so that they could experience the same violence of a rocket take-off. There were 400 eggs in each experimental group. All the egg cysts from the experiment were then placed in salt water to hatch under optimum conditions. As a result, a high sensitivity to cosmic radiation was observed on Artemia salina eggs; 90% of the embryos, which were induced to develop from hit eggs, died at different developmental stages.>>

Re: Orion turns out to be a Huntress, folks

by Ann » Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:23 am

Doug County wrote:
Given the active minds of our ancestors, may I humbly suggest that as our telescopes and other imaging technologies have "lifted the loincloth" of our much vaunted Orion the Hunter, it surprises me that nobody has caught on that instead of a progenitor of fatherhood, a close look at the nebulosity has revealed a very fecund birthing zone, a placental paradise for hundreds of proto and natal stellar-planetary systems! Isn't it obvious that our famed Hunter has been a Huntress all along?
:D :thumb_up:

Ann

Orion turns out to be a Huntress, folks

by Doug County » Fri Dec 09, 2016 5:25 am

OK, folks; constellations are projections placed onto the visible stars by cultures since time immemorial. The earliest depiction of the stars we call Orion go back some 32,000-38,000 years, carved into mammoth ivory and identified by the 3 central stars of the "modern" constellation. But just because Greek mythology depicting it as a Hunter was carried into present time more effectively by our literature doesn't mean that other cultures at other times and in other places weren't similarly impressed by the bright stars that exist in that part of the sky, inspiring a wide variety of other projections of their psyches including seeing the spine of a bison, a canoe, a scythe, a judge's stick, a deer, a rooster, a sheep and other images, just like a celestial Rorschach blot. Check out the following website for a summary discussion of this profusion of celestial projections: http://www.crystalinks.com/orion.html

Given the active minds of our ancestors, may I humbly suggest that as our telescopes and other imaging technologies have "lifted the loincloth" of our much vaunted Orion the Hunter, it surprises me that nobody has caught on that instead of a progenitor of fatherhood, a close look at the nebulosity has revealed a very fecund birthing zone, a placental paradise for hundreds of proto and natal stellar-planetary systems! Isn't it obvious that our famed Hunter has been a Huntress all along?

One can rule out the sword theory since anyone who has worn a sword knows that the last place you want to hang it is between your legs. As to the phallic theory, well, star forming regions are about as female as you can get in my estimation. The fact that it lies between the legs only enhances this fact, and indeed the trail just shows how the birthing process has been going on for a while, leaving a trail of many newborn stars and planets.

And lest folks be offended by such "realities" and fear that such statements are not for the ears and eyes of young ones, I cannot think of a single girl who would not be delighted to look up at the newborn stars and planets between the Huntress' legs and feel a connection in a very healthy and natural way.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by starsurfer » Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:13 pm

RBANDREO wrote:
hamilton1 wrote:
RedGargoyle wrote:Today's picture is great but appeared already on 16.03.2015.
Lots of APODs get repeated.
Actually, the text on yesterday's APOD is completely different than what was written back in 3/16/2015, and the main image this time is the annotated version, so while the image has been featured before (as pointed out, not unusual), technically these two APODs are quite different compared to other repeated ones :wink:

Cheers!
Rogelio
Do a mosaic of Aquila!!!

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by RBANDREO » Tue Dec 06, 2016 2:25 am

hamilton1 wrote:
RedGargoyle wrote:Today's picture is great but appeared already on 16.03.2015.
Lots of APODs get repeated.
Actually, the text on yesterday's APOD is completely different than what was written back in 3/16/2015, and the main image this time is the annotated version, so while the image has been featured before (as pointed out, not unusual), technically these two APODs are quite different compared to other repeated ones :wink:

Cheers!
Rogelio

A Tip of the Hatysa

by neufer » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:45 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iota_Orionis wrote: <<Iota Orionis (ι Ori, ι Orionis) is the brightest star in an asterism known as Orion's sword. It has the traditional names Hatsya or Hatysa and in Arabic, Na’ir al Saif, which means simply "the Bright One of the Sword." The apparent visual magnitude of Iota Orionis is 2.77, making it the eighth-brightest member of Orion. From parallax measurements, it is located at a distance of roughly 1,330 light-years (410 parsecs) from Earth.

Iota Orionis is a quadruple system dominated by a massive spectroscopic binary with an eccentric (e=0.764), 29-day orbit. The two components of ι Ori A are a stellar class O9 III star (blue giant) and a class B0.8 III/IV star about 2 magnitudes fainter. The collision of the stellar winds from this pair makes the system a strong X-ray source. Oddly, the two objects of this system appear to have different ages, with the secondary being about double the age of the primary. In combination with the high eccentricity of their orbit, this suggests that the binary system was created through a capture, rather than by being formed together and undergoing a mass transfer. This capture may have occurred, for example, through an encounter between two binary systems.

ι Ori has a B8 giant companion at 11" (approximately 5,000 AU) which has been shown to be variable, and likely to be a young stellar object. There is also a fainter A0 star at 49" catalogued as ι Ori C.>>

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Cousin Ricky » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:33 pm

Guest wrote:Clearly, morally bankrupt. Science should be about science. I get the humor aspect, but questionable content should have been deleted when discovered. You guys are just weird. - the kids are banned from this site. Not because of the comic, but the attitude towards the content herein... Sorry for playing in your sandbox. Now, I need a shower...
Keep this up and your kid is likely to become a statistic. (That is, if you really do have a kid.)

Think about which American states are most prudish about sex education. Then look up which states have the highest teen pregnancy rates.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Chris Peterson » Mon Dec 05, 2016 2:49 pm

Ann wrote:So as long as we are talking about official and well-established names of stars and star patterns on the sky, we should indeed refer to the thing that seems to hang between Orion's two "legs" as his sword! :makes stern teacher's face: :evil:
Of course... which is what makes the cartoon funny.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Ann » Mon Dec 05, 2016 5:07 am

I have been both amused and bemused by the "dong" discussion. Obviously neither constellations nor asterisms have corporeal bodies, therefore they don't have body parts, therefore they don't have dongs.

I certainly agree that that thing that looks like an appendage would be more aptly described as a dong than as a sword. I mean, what knight carries his sword over his crotch?

But here on Earth stars and star patterns have accepted designations that we humans have given them, and many of them have been in use for a long time, some for a few thousand years. "Orion's Dong" in not an accepted designation. I googled "Na'ir al Saif" and got 65,000 hits, and most of the hits on the first two pages actually refer to the star. The name means "The Bright One of the Sword", not "The Bright One of the Dong".

So as long as we are talking about official and well-established names of stars and star patterns on the sky, we should indeed refer to the thing that seems to hang between Orion's two "legs" as his sword! :makes stern teacher's face: :evil:

Ann

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by geckzilla » Mon Dec 05, 2016 1:09 am

Guest wrote:
geckzilla wrote:
Guest wrote:See? You just don't get it... This is not a family site. It should have an adult content warning. The kids are blocked. You could have had a laugh over the cartoon, but then removed it. It is time for you to look into yourself for morals, ethics and values...
Well, it's not for your family. Others are still just as welcome.
If some stranger walked up to your daughter or granddaughter in the local park and started talking about Orion's Dong, I think you would have a different attitude. You would turn the guy over to the police after beating him to a pulp. And I would help you do it. But for some reason, when it comes to the internet, you don't object to it. In fact you even defend it. Is this really your moral standard? Is this the example you want to set? What kind of a person are you? You should have removed the cartoon as soon as you became aware of it.
What you've done here is created a false equivocation between this comic, shared in jest, contextually appropriate for the discussion at hand, and a hypothetical and completely unrealistic version of a sexual predator. They're not the same. It's not even remotely similar. We're done here. You don't have to worry anymore about our disagreeing morals harming your family. Goodbye.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Guest » Mon Dec 05, 2016 12:05 am

geckzilla wrote:
Guest wrote:See? You just don't get it... This is not a family site. It should have an adult content warning. The kids are blocked. You could have had a laugh over the cartoon, but then removed it. It is time for you to look into yourself for morals, ethics and values...
Well, it's not for your family. Others are still just as welcome.
If some stranger walked up to your daughter or granddaughter in the local park and started talking about Orion's Dong, I think you would have a different attitude. You would turn the guy over to the police after beating him to a pulp. And I would help you do it. But for some reason, when it comes to the internet, you don't object to it. In fact you even defend it. Is this really your moral standard? Is this the example you want to set? What kind of a person are you? You should have removed the cartoon as soon as you became aware of it.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by geckzilla » Sun Dec 04, 2016 11:36 pm

Guest wrote:See? You just don't get it... This is not a family site. It should have an adult content warning. The kids are blocked. You could have had a laugh over the cartoon, but then removed it. It is time for you to look into yourself for morals, ethics and values...
Well, it's not for your family. Others are still just as welcome.

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by Guest » Sun Dec 04, 2016 11:08 pm

geckzilla wrote:
Guest wrote:
geckzilla wrote:A dong is a penis. Orion doesn't really have one, because that was just a silly joke. No stars have actual penises. It's really not that hard.
To a 7 year old girl, How do I explain this kind of stuff to her... Dongs? You just really don't get it. Given the questions she asked, I thought she was on a porn site, and then to find it was APOD, and she was asking this stuff??? You just don't get it!!!
I think I do get it. It embarrassed you. She was confused and had some honest questions and this is a relatively benign introduction to those questions. I think that both of you will be ok.
Guest wrote:Clearly, morally bankrupt. Science should be about science.
Science is done by people, and people have all sorts of opinions and ways of expressing themselves. We are not morally bankrupt simply because we do not share the same attitude or fears about anatomy that you do.
See? You just don't get it... This is not a family site. It should have an adult content warning. The kids are blocked. You could have had a laugh over the cartoon, but then removed it. It is time for you to look into yourself for morals, ethics and values...

Re: APOD: Orion and Official Star Names (2016 Dec 04)

by geckzilla » Sun Dec 04, 2016 10:49 pm

Guest wrote:
geckzilla wrote:A dong is a penis. Orion doesn't really have one, because that was just a silly joke. No stars have actual penises. It's really not that hard.
To a 7 year old girl, How do I explain this kind of stuff to her... Dongs? You just really don't get it. Given the questions she asked, I thought she was on a porn site, and then to find it was APOD, and she was asking this stuff??? You just don't get it!!!
I think I do get it. It embarrassed you. She was confused and had some honest questions and this is a relatively benign introduction to those questions. I think that both of you will be ok.
Guest wrote:Clearly, morally bankrupt. Science should be about science.
Science is done by people, and people have all sorts of opinions and ways of expressing themselves. We are not morally bankrupt simply because we do not share the same attitude or fears about anatomy that you do.

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