by neufer » Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:06 am
DavidACaruso wrote:I read the description of this, the "oldest complete star atlas known," with disbelief. It makes it sound like this, a somewhat crude map sketched by hand, represents the extent of ancient (less than 1500 years?) knowledge about the stars. The ignorance of the author is stunning when you consider the archeological evidence for the profound knowledge possessed by ancient Egyptian sages and astronomers. The alignments and positioning of their temples and monuments, the accuracy of their calendar (superior to ours, as it takes into account not just the cycles of the Sun and moon, but also, more importantly, of Sirius), among other things, shows great and complete knowledge. Though they did not fly in airplanes or spaceships, they knew the size of the Earth and their exact position on it. Modern scientist by and large have a great bias with regards their own knowledge and tend to dismiss the ancient scientists, though the evidence they left behind of their knowledge deserves better.
What ancient Egyptian sages and astronomers knew or did not know is mostly idle speculation.
(As is what ancient
Dogon "sages and astronomers" knew or did not know about Sirius B.)
The Chinese left us invaluable documents about eclipses, comets, supernova, sunspots and the positions of 1,300 stars :
http://sunearthday.nasa.gov/2008eclipse/ancienteclipses.php wrote:
<<By 2300 BC, ancient Chinese astrologers already had sophisticated observatory buildings, and as early as 2650 BC, Li Shu was writing about astronomy. According to historical records, a total of 27 observatories were built in the Yuan Dynasty but only the one in Dengfeng is known to have survived. Gaocheng Observatory is the oldest facility of its kind in China. The observatory dates to the early portion of the Yuan Dynasty (1271-1368 AD).
Established in 1279 AD by the famous astronomer Guo Shoujing, it was designed originally for use in predicting the time of the solstice each year.
Astronomers at the site were able to calculate the actual length of the year to 365.2425 days some 300 years before Europeans managed to develop the Gregorian calendar.
Chinese Firsts:
Although total solar eclipses were a cause for alarm and ill-omen, lunar eclipses were not feared by the people because they were so commonly seen. As a matter of fact the earliest recording of one was not until 1065 BC. Before this time, the event was only slightly mysterious. Lunar eclipse had weak astrological meaning in ancient China, so systematic records began from up to the 5th century. There were 545 records before 1500 AD in which 78 reported a total eclipse; 54 timed to the maximum or the contacts, 39 recorded maximum magnitude.
They were the first to spot Halley's Comet in 240 BC. As the "broom star" on the handle of Yin. But in the 613 BC Spring and Autumn Annals ( 春秋 Chūnqiū) of Confucius, he noted that "In July, there was a comet that entered the Big Dipper." ("秋七月，有星孛入于北斗。" qiū qīyuè, yǒu xīng1bèi rù yú běi3d ǒu).
The Mawangdui silk, a sketch book of cometary forms and the disasters associated with them, was compiled ca 300 B.C., but the knowledge it encompasses is believed to date as far back as 1500 B.C. Comets had been recorded, and drawn since the Shang Dynasty (1600 - 1046 BC).
The Chinese developed a system of 283 constellations, with identifies based upon natural objects rather than deities and historical figures as was the style of the Ancient Greeks. Constellations were called palaces, and the brightest star was the Emperor Star, with the fainter stars being the Princes. A constellation was called a "palace," with the major star being the emperor star and lesser stars being princes. The Fourth Century astronomer Shih-shen catalogued 809 stars among these constellations, but without any surviving sketches or sky maps, we an exact identification of these constellations is impossible from the earliest history of Chinese observations.
We know that they called the North Star, Bei Ji, and eventually created star maps. In the famous Dunhuang star map of 700 AD. This map is thought to date from the reign of Emperor Zhongzong of Tang (705-710 AD), founded in Dunhuang. The Dunhuang manuscript is the oldest surviving star map in the world. Ursa Major, Sagittarius and Capricornus are recognizable. The three colors (white, black and yellow) indicate the schools of astronomy of Shih Shen, Kan Te, and Wu Hsien. The whole set of star maps contained 1,300 stars.
They also noted sunspots as they would be infrequently observed when the sun was near the horizon and could be safely viewed through atmospheric absorption. No sketches of these sightings survives, although numerous written recordings have been found dating from ca 28 BC and later. The earliest mention may have been by an early astronomer Gan De (ca 500 BC). A sighting was also noted in the 165 BC encyclopedia The Ocean of Jade, of a figure identified as wang that appeared on the sun; a symbol like a cross with bars drawn across the top and bottom. By May 10, 28 BC, sunspots were noted in the official Imperial histories of China. Between 28 BC and 1638 AD, the historian Joseph Needham (1900-1995) identified 112 sightings in these records during the time before telescopic observations began in the West starting with Galileo in 1609.>>
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http://www.earthview.com/ages/history.htm wrote:
<<The earliest record of a solar eclipse comes from ancient China. The date of this eclipse, usually given as October 22, 2134 B.C., is not certain. Historians know the account was written sometime within a period of about two hundred years. During that time there were several total eclipses visible in China. The 2134 B.C. eclipse is simply the best guess. The ancient Chinese document Shu Ching records that "the Sun and Moon did not meet harmoniously." The story goes that the two royal astronomers, Hsi and Ho, had neglected their duties and failed to predict the event. Widespread Oriental belief held that an eclipse was caused by an invisible dragon devouring the Sun. Great noise and commotion (drummers drumming, archers shooting arrows into the sky, and the like) were customarily produced to frighten away the dragon and restore daylight. When this eclipse took place, the emperor was caught unprepared. Even though the Sun returned, the angry ruler ordered the astronomers beheaded!>>
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http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=a&id=2295 wrote:
<<Until the mid-1400s, the Chinese made the most detailed and complete observations of comets. As early as 200 b.c., they employed official skywatchers to record and interpret any new omens in the heavens. These officials recognized, some nine centuries before their European counterparts, that comet tails always point away from the Sun. The Chinese interest in comets, however, was for their astrological importance as signs of coming change.>>
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of ... bservation
<<In 185 CE, Chinese astronomers recorded the appearance of a bright star in the sky, and observed that it took about eight months to fade from the sky. It was observed to sparkle like a star and did not move across the heavens like a comet. These observations are consistent with the appearance of a supernova, and this is believed to be the oldest recorded by humankind. SN 185 may have also possibly been recorded in Roman literature, though no records have survived. The gaseous shell RCW 86 is suspected as being the remnant of this event, and recent X-ray studies show a good match for the expected age.
In 393 CE, the Chinese recorded the appearance of another "guest star", SN 393, in the modern constellation of Scorpius. Additional unconfirmed supernovae events may have been observed in 369 CE, 386 CE, 437 CE, 827 CE and 902 CE. However these have not yet been associated with a supernova remnant, and so they remain only candidates. Over a span of about 2,000 years, Chinese astronomers recorded a total of twenty such candidate events, including later explosions noted by Islamic, European and possibly Indian and other observers.
The supernova SN 1006 appeared in the southern constellation of Lupus during the year 1006 CE. This was the brightest recorded star ever to appear in the night sky, and its presence was noted in China, Egypt, Iraq, Italy, Japan and Switzerland. It may also have been noted in France, Syria and North America. Egyptian physician, astronomer and astrologer Ali ibn Ridwan gave the brightness of this star as one-quarter the brightness of the Moon. Modern astronomers have discovered the faint remnant of this explosion and determined that it was only 7,100 light-years from the Earth.
Supernova SN 1054 was another widely-observed event, with Arab, Chinese and Japanese astronomers recording the star's appearance in 1054 CE. It may also have been recorded by the Anasazi as a petroglyph. This explosion appeared in the constellation of Taurus, where it produced the Crab Nebula remnant. At its peak, the luminosity of SN 1054 may have been four times as bright as Venus, and it remained visible in daylight for 23 days and was visible in the night sky for 653 days.
There are fewer records of supernova SN 1181, which occurred in the constellation Cassiopeia just over a century after SN 1054. It was noted by Chinese and Japanese astronomers, however. The pulsar 3C58 may be the stellar relic from this event.>>
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[quote="DavidACaruso"]I read the description of this, the "oldest complete star atlas known," with disbelief. It makes it sound like this, a somewhat crude map sketched by hand, represents the extent of ancient (less than 1500 years?) knowledge about the stars. The ignorance of the author is stunning when you consider the archeological evidence for the profound knowledge possessed by ancient Egyptian sages and astronomers. The alignments and positioning of their temples and monuments, the accuracy of their calendar (superior to ours, as it takes into account not just the cycles of the Sun and moon, but also, more importantly, of Sirius), among other things, shows great and complete knowledge. Though they did not fly in airplanes or spaceships, they knew the size of the Earth and their exact position on it. Modern scientist by and large have a great bias with regards their own knowledge and tend to dismiss the ancient scientists, though the evidence they left behind of their knowledge deserves better.[/quote]
What ancient Egyptian sages and astronomers knew or did not know is mostly idle speculation.
(As is what ancient [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogon#Dogon_and_Sirius][b]Dogon "sages and astronomers"[/b][/url] knew or did not know about Sirius B.)
The Chinese left us invaluable documents about eclipses, comets, supernova, sunspots and the positions of 1,300 stars :
[quote=" http://sunearthday.nasa.gov/2008eclipse/ancienteclipses.php"]
<<By 2300 BC, ancient Chinese astrologers already had sophisticated observatory buildings, and as early as 2650 BC, Li Shu was writing about astronomy. According to historical records, a total of 27 observatories were built in the Yuan Dynasty but only the one in Dengfeng is known to have survived. Gaocheng Observatory is the oldest facility of its kind in China. The observatory dates to the early portion of the Yuan Dynasty (1271-1368 AD).
Established in 1279 AD by the famous astronomer Guo Shoujing, it was designed originally for use in predicting the time of the solstice each year. [b]Astronomers at the site were able to calculate the actual length of the year to 365.2425 days some 300 years before Europeans managed to develop the Gregorian calendar. [/b]
Chinese Firsts:
Although total solar eclipses were a cause for alarm and ill-omen, lunar eclipses were not feared by the people because they were so commonly seen. As a matter of fact the earliest recording of one was not until 1065 BC. Before this time, the event was only slightly mysterious. Lunar eclipse had weak astrological meaning in ancient China, so systematic records began from up to the 5th century. There were 545 records before 1500 AD in which 78 reported a total eclipse; 54 timed to the maximum or the contacts, 39 recorded maximum magnitude.
They were the first to spot Halley's Comet in 240 BC. As the "broom star" on the handle of Yin. But in the 613 BC Spring and Autumn Annals ( 春秋 Chūnqiū) of Confucius, he noted that "In July, there was a comet that entered the Big Dipper." ("秋七月，有星孛入于北斗。" qiū qīyuè, yǒu xīng1bèi rù yú běi3d ǒu).
The Mawangdui silk, a sketch book of cometary forms and the disasters associated with them, was compiled ca 300 B.C., but the knowledge it encompasses is believed to date as far back as 1500 B.C. Comets had been recorded, and drawn since the Shang Dynasty (1600 - 1046 BC).
[b]The Chinese developed a system of 283 constellations, with identifies based upon natural objects rather than deities and historical figures as was the style of the Ancient Greeks. Constellations were called palaces, and the brightest star was the Emperor Star, with the fainter stars being the Princes. A constellation was called a "palace," with the major star being the emperor star and lesser stars being princes. The Fourth Century astronomer Shih-shen catalogued 809 stars among these constellations, but without any surviving sketches or sky maps, we an exact identification of these constellations is impossible from the earliest history of Chinese observations.[/b]
[b]We know that they called the North Star, Bei Ji, and eventually created star maps. In the famous Dunhuang star map of 700 AD. This map is thought to date from the reign of Emperor Zhongzong of Tang (705-710 AD), founded in Dunhuang. The Dunhuang manuscript is the oldest surviving star map in the world. Ursa Major, Sagittarius and Capricornus are recognizable. The three colors (white, black and yellow) indicate the schools of astronomy of Shih Shen, Kan Te, and Wu Hsien. The whole set of star maps contained 1,300 stars.[/b]
They also noted sunspots as they would be infrequently observed when the sun was near the horizon and could be safely viewed through atmospheric absorption. No sketches of these sightings survives, although numerous written recordings have been found dating from ca 28 BC and later. The earliest mention may have been by an early astronomer Gan De (ca 500 BC). A sighting was also noted in the 165 BC encyclopedia The Ocean of Jade, of a figure identified as wang that appeared on the sun; a symbol like a cross with bars drawn across the top and bottom. By May 10, 28 BC, sunspots were noted in the official Imperial histories of China. Between 28 BC and 1638 AD, the historian Joseph Needham (1900-1995) identified 112 sightings in these records during the time before telescopic observations began in the West starting with Galileo in 1609.>>[/quote]------------------------------------------------------
[quote=" http://www.earthview.com/ages/history.htm"]
<<The earliest record of a solar eclipse comes from ancient China. The date of this eclipse, usually given as October 22, 2134 B.C., is not certain. Historians know the account was written sometime within a period of about two hundred years. During that time there were several total eclipses visible in China. The 2134 B.C. eclipse is simply the best guess. The ancient Chinese document Shu Ching records that "the Sun and Moon did not meet harmoniously." The story goes that the two royal astronomers, Hsi and Ho, had neglected their duties and failed to predict the event. Widespread Oriental belief held that an eclipse was caused by an invisible dragon devouring the Sun. Great noise and commotion (drummers drumming, archers shooting arrows into the sky, and the like) were customarily produced to frighten away the dragon and restore daylight. When this eclipse took place, the emperor was caught unprepared. Even though the Sun returned, the angry ruler ordered the astronomers beheaded!>>[/quote]------------------------------------------------------
[quote=" http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=a&id=2295"]
<<Until the mid-1400s, the Chinese made the most detailed and complete observations of comets. As early as 200 b.c., they employed official skywatchers to record and interpret any new omens in the heavens. These officials recognized, some nine centuries before their European counterparts, that comet tails always point away from the Sun. The Chinese interest in comets, however, was for their astrological importance as signs of coming change.>>[/quote]------------------------------------------------------
[quote]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_supernova_observation
<<In 185 CE, Chinese astronomers recorded the appearance of a bright star in the sky, and observed that it took about eight months to fade from the sky. It was observed to sparkle like a star and did not move across the heavens like a comet. These observations are consistent with the appearance of a supernova, and this is believed to be the oldest recorded by humankind. SN 185 may have also possibly been recorded in Roman literature, though no records have survived. The gaseous shell RCW 86 is suspected as being the remnant of this event, and recent X-ray studies show a good match for the expected age.
In 393 CE, the Chinese recorded the appearance of another "guest star", SN 393, in the modern constellation of Scorpius. Additional unconfirmed supernovae events may have been observed in 369 CE, 386 CE, 437 CE, 827 CE and 902 CE. However these have not yet been associated with a supernova remnant, and so they remain only candidates. Over a span of about 2,000 years, Chinese astronomers recorded a total of twenty such candidate events, including later explosions noted by Islamic, European and possibly Indian and other observers.
The supernova SN 1006 appeared in the southern constellation of Lupus during the year 1006 CE. This was the brightest recorded star ever to appear in the night sky, and its presence was noted in China, Egypt, Iraq, Italy, Japan and Switzerland. It may also have been noted in France, Syria and North America. Egyptian physician, astronomer and astrologer Ali ibn Ridwan gave the brightness of this star as one-quarter the brightness of the Moon. Modern astronomers have discovered the faint remnant of this explosion and determined that it was only 7,100 light-years from the Earth.
Supernova SN 1054 was another widely-observed event, with Arab, Chinese and Japanese astronomers recording the star's appearance in 1054 CE. It may also have been recorded by the Anasazi as a petroglyph. This explosion appeared in the constellation of Taurus, where it produced the Crab Nebula remnant. At its peak, the luminosity of SN 1054 may have been four times as bright as Venus, and it remained visible in daylight for 23 days and was visible in the night sky for 653 days.
There are fewer records of supernova SN 1181, which occurred in the constellation Cassiopeia just over a century after SN 1054. It was noted by Chinese and Japanese astronomers, however. The pulsar 3C58 may be the stellar relic from this event.>>[/quote]------------------------------------------------------